Author Topic: Losing to an AWFUL Movie like CRASH... (Read 48207 times)

tireiron · « **Reply #30 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 11:36 AM »

And it was also like getting kicked when Jake Gyllenhaal lost
to George Clooney. I know he's talented, and some of you
like him, but I don't anymore, since well before last night.

Toadily · « **Reply #31 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 11:42 AM »

well George did great in Syriana but actually if I didn't pick Jake I would have voted for
Giamatti. But they like George better I think.

bnjmn3 · « **Reply #32 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 12:09 PM »

Like and safe are the important words to remember when considering what happened at the Oscars in 2006....

BADBRAD · « **Reply #33 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 12:20 PM »

I think it was made pretty clear last night that Hollywood is very HOMOPHOBIC. BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN is on a list of films that includes NETWORK, GOODFELLAS, ALL THAT JAZZ, FARGO, L.A. CONFIDENTIAL that the Academy snubbed but have lived on, and will continue to enthrall all who watch them. BBM is a work of art and is a GREAT GIFT for all of us tO love forever.

BROKEBACK MOUNTAIN is still the most honored film of 2005; an nothing can take that away.

jackie62 · « **Reply #34 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:05 PM »

There are many reasons people voted for CRASH---- it is a good movie ,well acted but i don't feel especially original.

The Academy has many factions--- genuine CRASH fans, people stirred by it's subject matter and lovers of particular performances in it.

But sadly it also appears to have had a % of anti- bbm advocates . Ii live in the uk and there was a film prog on fri where an academy member explained how they and some friends would vote tactically to stop a certain movie winning.They would vote for the competition not because they liked it but to stop the other movie . No mention of either movie's name was made --- but i felt heart sick then.

This could be a total aberration and may account for a few votes only ,but i felt sad that it is possible bbm lost out not to a movie some people thought was better --- but simply one that didn't offend them in some way.

By all means let the "best" movie win,even if I don't agree with it , but surely people should vote honestly for what they truly think is best.

I'm sure this is just my paranoia --- and i know all the best picture nominees would have wanted a fair and open competition.

The magic of bbm remains unchanged for me.

Toadily · « **Reply #35 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:06 PM »

Quote from: jackie62 on Mar 06, 2006, 01:05 PM

There are many reasons people voted for CRASH---- it is a good movie ,well acted but i don't feel especially original.

The Academy has many factions--- genuine CRASH fans, people stirred by it's subject matter and lovers of particular performances in it.

But sadly it also appears to have had a % of anti- bbm advocates . Ii live in the uk and there was a film prog on fri where an academy member explained how they and some friends would vote tactically to stop a certain movie winning.They would vote for the competition not because they liked it but to stop the other movie . No mention of either movie's name was made --- but i felt heart sick then.

This could be a total aberration and may account for a few votes only ,but i felt sad that it is possible bbm lost out not to a movie some people thought was better --- but simply one that didn't offend them in some way.

By all means let the "best" movie win,even if I don't agree with it , but surely people should vote honestly for what they truly think is best.

I'm sure this is just my paranoia --- and i know all the best picture nominees would have wanted a fair and open competition.

The magic of bbm remains unchanged for me.

Whoa, you mean you heard an academy member say that? That's wild.

BBBOY · « **Reply #36 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:07 PM »

Quote from: tireiron on Mar 06, 2006, 11:30 AM

When Brokeback Mountain lost to Crash it was like getting kicked in the stomach. I saw
Crash, and liked it, but it had no heart, and wasn't remotely in a class with BBM.

But this morning, in a way, I think it might be better that it was Crash instead of one of
the other three that beat BBM, and that is because the other three had somber
historical subjects: Capote's writing of In Cold Blood, Edward R. Murrow vs. McCarthy, and
the Olympic murder of Israeli athletes. One of them might have been thought in the
future to be more 'worthy' because of its content.

But Crash is so unlikely to maintain its fleeting glory, because movie lovers are not that
stupid in the end, that part of Brokeback lore in the future may be, as it should be,
that it was unjustly denied what it deserved.

My thoughts exactly. Brokeback Mountain will have staying power as a truly great film, one of the finest if not finest love stories ever written. Crash will be a brief flash in the pan turned to smoke and blown away as if never there.

Cowboy Cody · « **Reply #37 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:10 PM »

Toad - that is not uncommon. I have heard that before in a program on the academy members. Certain directors, actors, etc. will not win because of politics or topics. Guess we know now where GAY fits in, don't we...we don't.

May the hounds of hell chew their underwear!

Toadily · « **Reply #38 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:13 PM »

What a bunch of jerks. I mean to vote for something just to vote AGAINST another movie.

Did you read the post about how surprised Jack Nicholson looked when he opened the envelope?
I didn't notice personally. (I didn't even remember he announced it, I blocked it out)

BADBRAD · « **Reply #39 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:14 PM »

Quote from: Cowboy Cody on Mar 06, 2006, 01:10 PM

Toad - that is not uncommon. I have heard that before in a program on the academy members. Certain directors, actors, etc. will not win because of politics or topics. Guess we know now where GAY fits in, don't we...we don't.

May the hounds of hell chew their underwear!

I think it is ironic that CRASH, which is about tolerance did not have a Gay character; it would have been fitting because Gays are ultimately treated worse than any race minority these days.

Toadily · « **Reply #40 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:18 PM »

Interesting point Brad.... Very interesting.

Ang said it is the "final frontier" and he is right I think.

You know I did like Crash, I did. I don't want to knock it.
But it's just not a best picture, it's provacative, it's intriguing.
But it's contrived and the dialogue is so obvious. and they
way they so cleverly tie it together, it's not a movie you think
about after you leave for very long.

bnjmn3 · « **Reply #41 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 01:43 PM »

Quote from: Toadily on Mar 06, 2006, 01:06 PM

Quote from: jackie62 on Mar 06, 2006, 01:05 PM
There are many reasons people voted for CRASH---- it is a good movie ,well acted but i don't feel especially original.

The Academy has many factions--- genuine CRASH fans, people stirred by it's subject matter and lovers of particular performances in it.

But sadly it also appears to have had a % of anti- bbm advocates . Ii live in the uk and there was a film prog on fri where an academy member explained how they and some friends would vote tactically to stop a certain movie winning.They would vote for the competition not because they liked it but to stop the other movie . No mention of either movie's name was made --- but i felt heart sick then.

This could be a total aberration and may account for a few votes only ,but i felt sad that it is possible bbm lost out not to a movie some people thought was better --- but simply one that didn't offend them in some way.

By all means let the "best" movie win,even if I don't agree with it , but surely people should vote honestly for what they truly think is best.

I'm sure this is just my paranoia --- and i know all the best picture nominees would have wanted a fair and open competition.

The magic of bbm remains unchanged for me.

Whoa, you mean you heard an academy member say that? That's wild.

Crash won because academy members voted against BBM's subject matter. Many of them refused to even watch it, remember?.....simple to see what was going on now.

ethan · « **Reply #42 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:13 PM »

You may want to read this post again

http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=1783.msg25483#msg25483

"I don't see any reason for this media created horse race. The only reason to predict/root for a loss for a film that has won the DGA, PGA, WGA, Globe, BFCA, BAFTA, the public imagination, big bog office, and the most Critics Awards is a reason known as wishful thinking. I know of no case of a film with this much of a haul losing the Best Picture crown to a film with barely any haul at all. So if you're predicting this upset/or rooting for it it means you either:

a) like Crash better. Which is fine. But maybe you should watch both films again? I'm just sayin'....
or
b) or you are just rooting against Brokeback. Which is a more significant problem. This means either

1) You're bored. Fine. There have been many "locked" contenders in Oscar history. You'll survive. Maybe next year will be more exciting... (believe me I know the feeling)
2) You think Munich or Capote or Good Night are the best. Fine. But you know those films aren't going to win so why root against Brokeback?
3) You're one of those people who think subject matter is all (never mind execution) and think terrorism or racism or McCarthyism are more important than the plight of two men in love in a world that condemns them. If you're one of these people I can't help you. And if you're one of those people who can't see that all four of those themes are basically conjoined under the larger "man's inhumanity to man" heading, I can't help you either. But that's beside the point. Subject matter never made anything the "best". It can help get people on your side but it isn't a qualitative measure.
or
4) you're struggling with some homophobia.

I realize saying #4 out loud will attract the haters. But I have to think that that's some of the resistance to this film's success. Hear me out before getting too riled up. I can't come up with any other way (and I've tried to work through scenarios) that this film could lose.

Oscarwatch floated the idea earlier that Crash could win if people vote with their hearts. But Brokeback is hardly a cold exercize. It's a tearjerker itself. So that reason doesn't wash. This is not a cold Scorsese biopic vs. a four-hankie intimate drama like last year or the year of Raging Bull vs. Ordinary People. Roger Ebert claims its all about Crash's momentum. But momentum usually applies to the newer film that is currently all the rage (BBM)

What we have is a film (BBM) with DGA + PGA + WGA+ GLOBE + CRITICS + PUBLIC + BAFTA + BOX OFFICE up against a film (Crash) with only a couple of prizes of note (SAG, ACE, WGA) and an earlier release date. I can't see any way Brokeback loses unless it's through people actively voting against it rather than for something else. Thus suggesting homophobia."

tireiron · « **Reply #43 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:26 PM »

This was posted by someone called "j.S." in the usenet newsgroup, rec.arts.movies.current-films.

It was nominated for 8 awards, itself an elite honor. It won 3,
including the single most impressive one, for Best Direction.
It has won scores of other impressive awards; more than any film the
past year. So many in fact, that one more, basically questionable one,
really wouldn't have mattered. Even without a single "award', it still
would be a consumate, extrordinary piece of filmmaking.
It has been astonishingly successful financially based upon cost/profit
ratio. DVD sales are going to be insane. It has achieved a level of
popularity among all segments of life, all over the world that surprised
the hell out of everybody. It's become a household word and has entered
into the nation's, and world's mass consciousness. It is bringing about,
to some degree, in some way, change into our society. And it will
continue to captivate and move audiences comprised of thoughtful,
intelligent human beings for many decades to come.
Brokeback Mountain a "loser?"
You've got to be kidding.

aimi15 · « **Reply #44 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:28 PM »

Quote from: tireiron on Mar 06, 2006, 04:26 PM

This was posted by someone called "j.S." in the usenet newsgroup, rec.arts.movies.current-films.

It was nominated for 8 awards, itself an elite honor. It won 3,
including the single most impressive one, for Best Direction.
It has won scores of other impressive awards; more than any film the
past year. So many in fact, that one more, basically questionable one,
really wouldn't have mattered. Even without a single "award', it still
would be a consumate, extrordinary piece of filmmaking.
It has been astonishingly successful financially based upon cost/profit
ratio. DVD sales are going to be insane. It has achieved a level of
popularity among all segments of life, all over the world that surprised
the hell out of everybody. It's become a household word and has entered
into the nation's, and world's mass consciousness. It is bringing about,
to some degree, in some way, change into our society. And it will
continue to captivate and move audiences comprised of thoughtful,
intelligent human beings for many decades to come.
Brokeback Mountain a "loser?"
You've got to be kidding.

Amen to that.

scruffy · « **Reply #45 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:44 PM »

Crash had a very large cast and crew. Pretty much everyone in Hollywood either took part or knew someone that took part in the movie. In this case a vote for Crash was a vote for a friend. This has happened before when "Around the World in 80 Days" won best picture. It wasn't really the best movie produced that year but pretty much everyone famous in Hollywood had a cameo appearance in it.

I have a feeling that the Academy really outed itself with the Crash decission. There have been rumours that there were a lot of politics involved but this was really a blatant move on their part. Remember during the Salt Lake City Winter Olympics when the Canadian skaters, who clearly won the gold medal, lost due to a judging scandal? Well, this is going to be the Academy scandal. The Academy is going to have to do a lot of back peddling. The credibility of the Academy Awards is truly at stake. I for one, will be more prone to watch the BAFTAS or the Golden Globes from now on. The Academy has lost touch but not necessarily with America. They have lost touch with their moral center.

ethan · « **Reply #46 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:47 PM »

Speaking of Golden Globes, Crash was not even nominated.

*Froggy* · « **Reply #47 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:48 PM »

Quote from: ethan on Mar 06, 2006, 04:47 PM

Speaking of Golden Globes, Crash was not even nominated.

aimi15 · « **Reply #48 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 04:51 PM »

Did it get anything at BAFTAS? Thats so far back in memory banks

Toadily · « **Reply #49 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 05:40 PM »

Quote from: ethan on Mar 06, 2006, 04:47 PM

Speaking of Golden Globes, Crash was not even nominated.

Good point. I don't get it.

BBBOY · « **Reply #50 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 06:06 PM »

I just read on some other site a quote by actor Tony Curtis that he refused to see BrokeBack Mountain and voted against it which is a clear violation of Academy rules. And if I'm not mistaken, and possibly some of you older fellows like me can back me up, Tony was known as quite a swinger in his younger days. How dare he!

BADBRAD · « **Reply #51 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 06:24 PM »

Quote from: BBBOY on Mar 06, 2006, 06:06 PM

I just read on some other site a quote by actor Tony Curtis that he refused to see BrokeBack Mountain and voted against it which is a clear violation of Academy rules. And if I'm not mistaken, and possibly some of you older fellows like me can back me up, Tony was known as quite a swinger in his younger days. How dare he!

Mr. Curtis has been rumored to be bisexual. I guess he was afraid to see 2 hot guys getting it on now that he is a old troll. He sounds like a bitter old queen.

Krispera · « **Reply #52 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 06:30 PM »

Oh well.. BBM will be remembered, Crash not. Still, it's painful :'(

From OSCARWATCH.COM

The Crash upset takes its first casualty, only the best awards database site there is, Fennec. They track the Golden Globes and the guilds and of course, the Oscars. Here's to hoping they are just pissed off and will return again:

Now it might be homophobia, or it might not, we just don't know. It may be stupid actors voting for the actor-rich movie, we don't know. Whatever the reason, this piece of shit has forced me to do something I didn't think possible. I give up.

I cannot bring myself to update this website saying that the film the Academy Of Motion Picture Arts And Sciences selected was the best of the year. Therefore, the Fennec Awards Database is closing down. Effective immediately there will be no more updates to the film side (the Tonys section will have an update later this year).

I had no idea that my personal joy at going to the movies and seeing them rewarded with Oscars could be so irreparably destroyed. But tonight it has been. I see roughly 200 per year (and pay for each and every one of them) and have paid for this website out of my personal pocket for the last 10 years. And after this travesty, it just doesn't seem worth it to continue if this is the crap the Academy will acclaim.

No doubt many will say "oh come on, give me a break, it's just the Oscars, who cares" or "Crash deserved it!" or "They just liked Crash better!" But take it from someone who's been around almost as long as Fennec when you hold something under a microscope be prepared to not like what you see so close up.

RIP Greatest Database There Ever Was

dirtbiker · « **Reply #53 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 06:32 PM »

Quote from: BADBRAD on Mar 06, 2006, 06:24 PM

Mr. Curtis has been rumored to be bisexual. I guess he was afraid to see 2 hot guys getting it on now that he is a old troll. He sounds like a bitter old queen.

LOL

Italian_Dude · « **Reply #54 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 07:56 PM »

Okay, I know we all hate Crash. I do too, but I have to say I love the movie posters

[attachment deleted by admin]

Krispera · « **Reply #55 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 07:58 PM »

Quote from: Italian_Dude on Mar 06, 2006, 07:56 PM

Okay, I know we all hate Crash. I do too, but I have to say I love the movie posters

I LOVE THEM

Italian_Dude · « **Reply #56 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 07:59 PM »

I would buy the Crash DVD if it put that on the DVD case haha!

camom · « **Reply #57 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 08:21 PM »

Quote from: Cowboy Cody on Mar 06, 2006, 01:10 PM

May the hounds of hell chew their underwear!

OK, that's just too funny. What a classic curse!

Cowboy, you need a real big hug. (((From me to you))). We're not ALL homophobes.

camom

camom · « **Reply #58 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 08:30 PM »

Quote from: aimi15 on Mar 06, 2006, 04:28 PM

Quote from: tireiron on Mar 06, 2006, 04:26 PM
This was posted by someone called "j.S." in the usenet newsgroup, rec.arts.movies.current-films.

It was nominated for 8 awards, itself an elite honor. It won 3,
including the single most impressive one, for Best Direction.
It has won scores of other impressive awards; more than any film the
past year. So many in fact, that one more, basically questionable one,
really wouldn't have mattered. Even without a single "award', it still
would be a consumate, extrordinary piece of filmmaking.
It has been astonishingly successful financially based upon cost/profit
ratio. DVD sales are going to be insane. It has achieved a level of
popularity among all segments of life, all over the world that surprised
the hell out of everybody. It's become a household word and has entered
into the nation's, and world's mass consciousness. It is bringing about,
to some degree, in some way, change into our society. And it will
continue to captivate and move audiences comprised of thoughtful,
intelligent human beings for many decades to come.
Brokeback Mountain a "loser?"
You've got to be kidding.
Amen to that.

Double amen.

camom

Cowboy Cody · « **Reply #59 on:** Mar 06, 2006, 08:31 PM »

Camom - I know you are not. I really appreciate your kind words and your hugs! You are good people. You understand what the vast majority of Americans don't and may never understand. We owe a debt of gratitude to those like yourself for sticking up for us. Those types of bonds can change things. Thank You.
Cody