I think that Jack’s death reformed Ennis…Apart from the plight of suffering and trauma he went through he also had an insight that Jack completed him…He was his soulmate and always will be and I think that Ennis will live by those precious memories and love Jack for the rest of his life….Ennis must have hated himself as to what he put Jack through…He must be thinking about forgiveness many times and moreover even though Ennis knew that Jack understood his childhood fears and fears of the society, I hope Ennis forgave himself…Although the positive me believes that Ennis did live the rest of his life with Jack always with him in his heart as his strength and support...
Thomas has inspired and encouraged me to start this topic…Thanks for that Thomas...
This topic is to put light on Ennis life after Jack passed away and how he will forgive himself and attain release from all the pain...There is no doubt that Ennis will always be one with Jack in spirit and his heart will always belong Jack and he will live his life with that pure, unselfish and immortal love. I know that this will be too difficult for Ennis but he will live to keep Jack’s love alive…
Please share your valuable thoughts and opinions on this..Thanks a ton dear Brokies...
I loved your post, but my state of mind still wants to avoid thinking about this. I can not stand thinking about so many lonely years that could have been so beautiful and happy. When I write this post, I can hardly breathe! It is so definite, so devastating... :\'(Thanks Loreen..I can understand what u r going through…I feel that every time him I watch the film and I know that when I will watch it next, it will be the same..Sometimes these thoughts come to my mind and it will makes me sad...So many years and so much regret…The pain and suffering of so many years gets to me….am left hollow and vulnerable..I need to to release Ennis from the pain after Jack passed away and somewhere I even needed myself and a lot others also to free from that pain... I think that when he saw the shirt it dawned onto him as to how precious he is and what he means to Jack….I think he never wated that to die…Death can never take away what love they shared nor any barrier created by man can change that..I really believe that he did live a long life because he was loved and he would never let that go away...I think there r very few people who find true love....they r fortunate...Ennis found his soulmate and I know that many some opportunities were not considered by Ennis when Jack was alive which Ennis does regret...But after all that pain and suffering a huge part of me believes and feels that Ennis did find meaning in his life…He found out that Jack gave him that meaning and that could never be destroyed...He lived his life with this strong faith.. This way he lived for Jack for forever and ever….
Anyway I liked how someone said on another topic - Jack is for sure waiting Ennis on Brokeback mountain, where one day when Ennis says Goodbye to this valley of tears, they'll be together forever. This thought can make my heart only a little less suffer and I just need to skip the lonely years of Ennis until that happy moment.
I still go to bed and get up with E&J in my mind! When I manage to put them aside, I will have more to offer. At the moment I am blocked with as unbearable pain! (Usually not as stupid as now! ??? )
$)
Thanks smartestsonia!Thanks Thomas..I loved your expalination of reformation and transformation….I think that Ennis would have been shattered if he would not have considered forgiving himself..As I had earlier said that it would have been the most difficult thing to do…But Ennis did want to live for his daughters and Ennis did also want to live for Jack…He wanted to live keeping Jack alive in his thoughts, memories and feelings…When I personally think about it, it almost chokes me but I make myself strong…
I sometimes go back and forth between the terms "reformation" and "transformation" when it comes to describe Ennis after Jack's death.
Both terms are tied in with my idea of the role of forgiveness.
Specifically, did Ennis have the heart to forgive himself for what he saw as his part in Jack's sorrow and demise?
The clue, I think, is in Ennis's acceptance of his daughter's marriage invitiation.
His wanting to make a fresh start indicates a willingness to forgive himself and look past the previous failings. Jack's death had enabled him to take stock on his life's own priorities, and move in a direction that showed that he was ready to make amends -- if not with Jack, then with someone he also loved deeply.
I think "reformation" indicates a going back to a previous state, whereas "transformation" indicates going beyond the old self. Deep down, I think forgiveness (especially the ability to forgive oneself) is a transformative power. It is only in one's ability to forgive one's past failings that one is able to move beyond the former self.
I think that the final "I swear" also serves in part as a plea to forgiveness.
Perfect, Thomas!
Thanks Thomas..I loved your expalination of reformation and transformation….I think that Ennis would have been shattered if he would not have considered forgiving himself..As I had earlier said that it would have been the most difficult thing to do…But Ennis did want to live for his daughters and Ennis did also want to live for Jack…He wanted to live keeping Jack alive in his thoughts, memories and feelings…When I personally think about it, it almost chokes me but I make myself strong…
I think Ennis learned things in life the hardest way anybody goes through emotionally…I think Jack always wanted him to be strong and courageous and he will be strong for Jack to keep Jack's love alive...
I should be the one to thank you, smartestsonia.I agree with ya Thomas...You can call me Cleo...
I think the older Ennis's saving grace was his ability to forgive himself, even though he will never be able to forget the missed opportunity that was his for the taking. It takes a lot of courage (and humility) to forgive oneself, especially when one has ther wisdom of hindsight. Yes, as you said, it was a very TOUGH lesson. But he did not come away completely destroyed.
You bring up a very interesting point: I also think that Jack would have wanted Ennis to be strong -- not keep everything within himself, but to face the world in a new and better light. This would only be possible if one can accept one's failings -- and there can be no acceptance without forgiveness...
I agree with ya Thomas...You can call me Cleo...
I think its huge to forgive oneself...the key to that is acceptance of ones own flaws and to learn from it…it is a great step towards self realization and to acknowledge ones failures…Its a worst scenario when one needs to forgive himself after he puts someone else through a difficult time and then he wants to apologize to that person but that person is gone away forever…This thought gets to me in the final scene…Ennis wants to apologize to Jack but he cant do it…That makes forgiveness difficult as Jack is not physically around.,.,But I think that Ennis was able to forgive himself inspite of Jack not being physically around...This was a great step to live a life ahead...He wanted to live and will live…He will hope that Jack has forgiven him for his shortcomings…Jack would have been disheartened to see Ennis suffer and he always wanted Ennis to be happy and Ennis will for the rest of his life to keep Jack happy...He will live for Jack and that is one of the greatest symbol of love
Thanks Cleo -- and yes, the is opening up to self-forgiveness is the beginning of true healing and self-acceptance.After reading your post I suddenly remembered something I mentioned before in another topic that the final scene belonged to Ennis as much as it belonged to Jack..I think we have the same opinion about that.....I could literally feel his presence in the final scene...As if Jack’s soul is in those shirts and Ennis is hugging them…Jack as an angel will always be with Ennis...Ennis will sense him wherever he goes…I think living ones life for another person is one of the greatest gestures of love…I hope and believe Ennis will exactly do that….He will live for Jack and he will feel him everywhere in the mountains, near the lake, the greenery and above all in his heart..
For some reason, I get the feeling that Jack is very much present in that last scene. The presence is established in the closet at LF, where I feel that Ennis is truly hugging Jack. Not physical, but just as palpable -- and perhaps more real than real.
After reading your post I suddenly remembered something I mentioned before in another topic that the final scene belonged to Ennis as much as it belonged to Jack..I think we have the same opinion about that.....I could literally feel his presence in the final scene...As if Jack’s soul is in those shirts and Ennis is hugging them…Jack as an angel will always be with Ennis...Ennis will sense him wherever he goes…I think living ones life for another person is one of the greatest gestures of love…I hope and believe Ennis will exactly do that….He will live for Jack and he will feel him everywhere in the mountains, near the lake, the greenery and above all in his heart..
Although the positive me believes that Ennis did live the rest of his life with Jack always with him in his heart as his strength and support...
I think "reformation" indicates a going back to a previous state, whereas "transformation" indicates going beyond the old self. Deep down, I think forgiveness (especially the ability to forgive oneself) is a transformative power. It is only in one's ability to forgive one's past failings that one is able to move beyond the former self.
I think that the final "I swear" also serves in part as a plea to forgiveness.
The positive in me believes that too ^f^
His acceptance of Junior’s invitation was big- I think he saw that same look in her eyes that he’d seen in Jack too many times before. And he learned that life is too short, you cannot prepare for what may or may not happen- life is going to happen and keeping those you love at arms length sometimes leaves you holding an empty shirt. I think that Ennis’s steps in those regards are a great tribute to Jack.
Call it wishful thinking, but in that last scene, I also felt that Jack forgave him. I would assume that you felt the same way? I could pretty much imagine the spirit of Jack moving Ennis to take stock of his relationship with his daughter and change for the better. I don't think Ennis could have done what he did in the final scene without having the strength to forgive himself first. There was hope...I think that Jack did forgive Ennis...Jack very well knew why Ennis felt and behaved in the way he did...Jack understood Ennis’s deep seated childhood fears…As a child witnessing a cruel death is traumatic...Jack was so empathic and his heart melted when he heard about Ennis childhood experiences.....He knew that Ennis was a victim of so many fears...
I agree. But sometimes I think we are quicker to forgive others than ourselves. We are at times our biggest champions and our worst enemies.
How I see Ennis’s fate at the end depends wholly on my mood. After my first viewing, my thoughts were consumed with him in that little trailer with those shirts. Sometimes I think he went on to have a long life, having been able to find some peace with what happened and with himself. Other times I see him as so lost. His acceptance of Junior’s invitation was big- I think he saw that same look in her eyes that he’d seen in Jack too many times before. And he learned that life is too short, you cannot prepare for what may or may not happen- life is going to happen and keeping those you love at arms length sometimes leaves you holding an empty shirt. I think that Ennis’s steps in those regards are a great tribute to Jack.
I’ve always wondered about that final shot, after he closes the closet door. This will probably come out all convoluted so bear with me. Through his window we see a bit of road, the blue sky and a field of yellow and green. I looked up the meanings of colors and got this: Blue may be truth; it is linked to loyalty and constancy. Yellow stands for both light and cowardice. Green stands for envy, growth, renewal, and life. The cowardice is in between the truth and growth or maybe it’s the light that is in-between. Green is the dominating color which suggests that Ennis is on the road to renewal. I think the little stretch of road indicates that he doesn’t have that far to go.
But then I wonder if we are seeing what he can’t see (yet) because when he opens that closet door and visits that altar maybe in an act of penance, it blocks out that view. The shots of him buttoning the shirt is an interesting juxtaposition to me in that we see both where he’s been and where he is going side by side. Sometimes I see him closing the door and turning away as a sign that he isn’t quite ready to embrace all that he’s learned. Other times I see it as him closing the door on what he can’t change and that very last shot as hopeful.
I think that Jack did forgive Ennis...Jack very well knew why Ennis felt and behaved in the way he did...Jack understood Ennis’s deep seated childhood fears…As a child witnessing a cruel death is traumatic...Jack was so empathic and his heart melted when he heard about Ennis childhood experiences.....He knew that Ennis was a victim of so many fears...
He knew that Ennis dint want his kids to know about their relation. I think Jack would definitely forgive Ennis as Ennis did everything out of his own misery…Ennis never intentionally wanted to hurt Jack and Ennis loved Jack beyond limits…Jack knew that…
Even after the final confronation Jack was completely shattered and his look seeing Ennis walking away after the fight gives me chills..He was hurt to the core..But I think at that time there were a lot of things that were roaming around Jack's mind…Inspite of being sore and devastated at the bottom of his heart he knew that what he and Ennis shared is the most precious thing to both...He knew it was the same with Ennis even though he has never told that…So much is left unspoken between them..but inspite of that my heart strongly says that they understood each others strenghts and weakness and problems…
I think in the final scene Jack was looking at Ennis and comforting him and Ennis found the strenght of forgiving himself with the faith that Jack has forgiven him for his weaknesses and miserable situation...
Another thing always come to my mind as I often and intensively think about the reasons of PBS! That's Jack's death - so sensesless, so "unimportant", not even defined (we don't know for sure how he died), so tragic, so stupid, so unnecessary.... Everything about his death is strange as he is one the main characters, but suddenly he dissapears, with no word, no significant sign.... How can someone so so important to others (I include Bobby and Lureen here) vanish without a proper closure... So strange death! So unexpected!
I think that this presentation of his death make the movie much harder to take, and our PBS is going wild..... :\'( :\'( :\'(
I also believe that Jack forgave Ennis. And for a specific reason, I think of it as being entirely unconditional. We see the biggest hint in the DE itself, where he didn't care whether Ennis's love was not perfect. This is I think what he recalled most in that final look in the Last Confrontation -- and what probably comforted him as he perhaps decided to move on: that he will always have that love for Ennis, no matter what.
I sometimes feel that Jack not only had forgiven Ennis,but also that must forgive himself somehow.I mean that IMO he felt in their last goodbye a little guilty by perhaps having decided to move on with Randall.He knew at that moment that Ennis love was deeper than he ever had thought and came to termns of understanding him more than before.So,he perfectly could feel himself guilty of having put another person between the two of them.What's your opinion about this?.
I find your post very true and right,Loreen,and I'm saying the truth;but I'm still believe that Randall was not only a sexual relief for Jack-he had got it during so many years with the Mexican prostitutes,as a matter fo fact...-,but also an emotional relief.We don't know for sure which is the real role Randall played in Jack's decision of moving on-in the movie it's very few said about it and in the s.s. it simply doesn't exist...-; but I do believe that Jack had arrived to feel a little-or very-fed up about this so unsatisfactory situation they were living.He was measuring between his great love for Ennis and the possibility of beguinning a new life where his lover didn't want to have a place;of course,he loved him still so,so,so much and for this reason his behaviour in FC.But he needed also to relief his mind and heart,not only his body.
Anyhow,I'm afraid we're a little *o) ; there's another thread where we can speak about Randall's role in this story,that is:http://ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=11865.0 (http://ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=11865.0)
Unfortunately, Ennis's inner distractions were too hard to accept Jack's love completely,and Jack DID UNDERSTAND THAT! But he needed more... and Randall was just a convenient opportunity. Nothing more than that!
Another thing: if Jack was really giving up on Ennis, would he be so irritated because of so late meeting (in November?)...No! He would've say: OK; Ennis, you just keep on working, I found myself a man who always have enough time, with available cabin, and a good will to take me to the heaven!
But Jack didn't say that! He embraced Ennis, and hold him tight,, letting him know that he's there for him always. If Jack hadn't gone, he'd still be happy to drive 14 hours just to make love to his Brokeback mountain friend and lover!
Uh! %&)
I found so many of you take Randall as someone important in Jack's life.... Well I don't! It's just that I follow both SS and the movie, and there's no room for no one else there. Jack had been with many other men, and if he's beaten to death (Most probably!), that was not because someone found out about Ennis, but rather bacause of promiskuitet behavior, which could've attract the attention of murderers!
But Randall itself... for me he's only an episode, someone near, available, handsome and willing to do it!
And I could not possibly imagine that dandy to go to live in LF??? I truly don't think so! :*(
Hello Loreen. ^f^
I disagree with you here, sorry. Jack didn’t understand that. First Jack thought that Ennis couldn’t be with him because he was married and he couldn’t leave Alma and the girls. That’s why Jack was so happy when he learned that Ennis had divorced. But then he found out that Alma was not the reason that kept them apart. You can see his slow realization when he follows Ennis’ eyes when he looks at that truck on the road. Jack knew then that Ennis was not with him because of his fears, yes, but also because of his paranoia. If Jack had understood Ennis reasons to be apart, he wouldn’t have been that bitter and hurt for so many years. He sure loved Ennis beyond limits but he didn’t get why they couldn’t live together. I mean, in the last confrontation when Jack said to Ennis that they could have had a good life together, he doesn’t said “but you couldn’t Ennis” but “but you did NOT want, Ennis”. Jack thought that Ennis simply didn’t want to live with him, you know. Because Jack was also scared, but when you love someone you fight and take changes and risks, and that’s why Jack didn’t get why Ennis didn’t act like him.
Well, baby, if you see the film again you’ll hear Jack saying before the last confrontation that he was gonna go and see his parents after they parted. And then you can see that OMT said that Jack told him about that ranch foreman the last spring. Jack used to see his folks after every fishing trip, and the very Jack said to Ennis that he was gonna go to LF now. So Jack told his father his plans about the foreman after the confrontation scene, when he left the mountain and went to LF.
I’ve never thought not even for a second that Jack gave up on Ennis, and I’m sure he’d have been on the mountain coming November. But it’s sure that Jack was terrible hurting that spring, and maybe, like Thomas said once, he thought that it was the best for Ennis if he left Ennis alone, because Jack saw that Ennis was suffering a lot having that relationship with him, and that he renounce lots of things to be with Jack. So sometimes the greatest prove of love is leave your lover be, quit him, and sacrifice yourself in order to give him peace. Maybe Jack wanted to give up on Ennis not for himself but for Ennis, you know, to stop hurting him, because Ennis said that he was like that because of Jack (I'm nothin. I'm nowhere). I don’t know.
Like I’ve said, yeah, he’d have been there, but Jack was NOT happy anymore driving 14 hours to see his lover. That’s why Jack was so bitter and angry and desperate. That was not enough for him. Those fishing trips were more and more infrequent, and briefer, and Jack was so hungry for more. He needed to live with Ennis the whole damn time, every day, and not only a week in the middle of nowhere, hidden like if they were criminals. Jack said yes to Ennis terms when they were young because in that moment it was all whet he could do to not loose Ennis. Little is better than nothing. But now it hurt so much. Jack wants more, still is dreaming, but he can see that it’ll always like that, meeting on a mountain, never live together, and Jack is bitter and disappointed. He still keeps meeting with Ennis, because he can’t help it, he loves him so so so much, but happy to drive 14 hours to spend only seven days with Ennis? Mmmm..if that was like that Jack had not been that angry and serious and sad. Jesus, you can see his face that last night they spent together. Where was that chatty, happy, sweet smiling man? He was just a broken ghost of what he was. He was bleeding inside. All those years of !@#$ fishing trips were killing him slowly. That last trip he finally understood that Ennis will never live with him...and that shattered him, and sure he was so blind with pain that he started to talk about Randall, because he only wanted a man by his side, someone to love and be loved by. Jack was only trying to find a substitute for Ennis, to try to forget him, because maybe he thought that he was wasting his life, chasing dreams to never come true. He maybe thought that he deserved more than hidding on a mountain. He was not happy anymore with those fishing trips, and besides they were more infrequent because of Ennis jobs, so maybe for Jack it was another sign saying that Ennis didn’t want him like before.
Some brokies here said that even if Jack had given up on Ennis, that doesn’t mean that their love had died. Jack couldn’t stop love Ennis, and no matter if he was gonna live with Randall or not, Ennis got his whole heart, Ennis will always and forever be the love of his life.
Well, I’m sure Jack didn’t love Randall, but Randall was not only a f*ck buddy. I mean, they spent almost 5 years together (you can see that in the Screenplay), so they were friends for sure, good friends.
All of this is only my humble opinion, and please notice that I’d written lots of “maybe”, because I don’t know, we don’t know for sure.
Sorry for the big OT. I’ll shut up now. :-X
Seeing Randall so important to himself, so well dressed, real dandy... I can not believe that he would consider even for a second to go to live in such a sad place as LF. All this talking about Randall was Jack's way to avoid his pain, to talk anything just to forget Ennis.
Baby, that's exactly what I said in my post. Lots of brokies here never believed not even for a second that Randall was gonna live with Jack in LF. We think that maybe it was another Jack's dream, just like when he said to his father that someday he was gonna bring Ennis.
I never blamed Jack for his infidelities. I understood him from the very beginning. It'll take me a lot to try and explain my theory about infidelities, because of my English, but I can tell you that Jack didn't it that on purpose or wanting to hurt Ennis....Jack was a big wound on legs...That was his only way to endure the pain. **sigh** Now, I think I'm gonna cry. My Jack.... :\'( :\'(
I knew that I shouldn't come back to the forum. Some things hurt too much.
Thank you for your reply, baby. ^f^
I sometimes feel that Jack not only had forgiven Ennis,but also that must forgive himself somehow.I mean that IMO he felt in their last goodbye a little guilty by perhaps having decided to move on with Randall.He knew at that moment that Ennis love was deeper than he ever had thought and came to termns of understanding him more than before.So,he perfectly could feel himself guilty of having put another person between the two of them.What's your opinion about this?.
I sometimes feel that Jack not only had forgiven Ennis,but also that must forgive himself somehow.I mean that IMO he felt in their last goodbye a little guilty by perhaps having decided to move on with Randall.He knew at that moment that Ennis love was deeper than he ever had thought and came to termns of understanding him more than before.So,he perfectly could feel himself guilty of having put another person between the two of them.What's your opinion about this?.I completely agree with ya MPJ...I think Jack did feel guilty but in FC he was so hurt of being sidelined for so many years that he dint bring that up..At the FC he felt that Ennis should have given him more time or they should have lived together and then all would have been fine...I think in the final scene Ennis and Jack did forgive each other and themselves..Ennis knew that Jack understood why he was so and he hoped for forgiveness and IMO had faith that he was forgiven by Jack...Jack's presence is felt too strongly in the final scene and I think that Jack also did forgive Ennis for all....In FC after Ennis left a part of Jack did hope for forgiveness himself...Jack saw how destroyed Ennis became when he got to know that Jack went to Mexico..he saw him crying and breaking down...Jack would have never ever wanted to hurt Ennis or put him through so much grief..looking at all this Jack of course would have been guilty too...When I personally of think all this I feel that they both reacted to the situation which came in front of them...I know that there were regrets as to how things could have been different but am sure that Ennis did learn the depths of Jacks' love and his love for Jack in the FC...A love shared forever and ever
wow, i gotta say you brokies sure are a deep lot and i really did feel inspired reading all the excellent posts of opinions on this topic. The reason i wanted to see what others thought on this topic was b/c i had read an article in the LA times where they interviewed Annie Proulx about how this story came about, and she said that one night at a bar in Wyoming she actually saw Ennis, not actually the fictional character but just an old lonely hungry man sitting alone at a bar full of young people and that was the birth of Ennis in her mind.
I know Ennis was a strong fella and he would have just "stood it" the rest of his life no matter how painful it was not having Jack in it anymore. Perhaps I'm just a pessimist but despite the fact that in the SS Ennis did continue to find a great deal of comfort from recurrent dreams of Jack (hence in a sense Jack is still very much present and alive in Ennis' life) Ennis ultimately ends up living the very tragic life that I believe jack wanted to save Ennis and himself from. To me this story will always be a great tragedy no matter how many spins we put on the ending or on the transformation of Ennis as a person at the end of the movie. Life trudges on as we all well know and to lose someone so important will always remain a source of pain, and knowing that nobody could nor will ever replace that one lost is cause for further sadness and despair.
In the SS after the last confrontation, Proulx writes "Nothing ended, nothing begun, nothing resolved." I feel both characters understood and knew how deeply they were loved by the other and at the same time how their relationship was always and would continue to be one that brought unsurpassed joy yet at the same time limitless sadness for neither could "quit" the other despite all the anger and frustration of wanting to surpass this impasse because they knew that their relationship was what defined them at the core and gave their existence meaning. For anyone who has had a relationship like this knows as a truth that it is the one love to which none other will ever compare nor replace.
In the last scene which was as we all agree magnificently acted by both Heath and Jake, we see that nothing has really changed since they were young men back up at brokeback herding sheep. Ennis drives away to resume his life and Jack understands and maybe even finally accepts however unwillingly that this is they way it will always be, its is the way they will always be, forever trapped in that blissful pain. He will never have the life he dreams of because he sees that Ennis will always be Ennis and no matter what Jack says or does he would not be able to make Ennis be what he wants and Jack would always desire to live his days with Ennis and nothing Ennis says or does would ever change that. Ultimately jack accepts Ennis for who he is and their relationship for what it is. Proulx ends their final parting encounter with "Let be, let be."
Ms. Proulx says that when she saw that old man in the bar, she knew there had to be a Jack for that Ennis, and hence the birth of the characters and the story in her mind. This is why i think that in the end Ennis became a sad, lonely old man who despite everything that happened still craved the real, emotional, physical, tangible connection with another human being that i feel we all crave, and which he had the great fortune to find but ultimately for uncontrollable reasons could not keep. Therein lies the deep tragic nature of the story and maybe of humanity...... despite the profound love, it was not enough to change the course of fate.
apologies for the down nature of the post, IF i can find that article again i will post it here to share with everyone.
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I know Ennis was a strong fella and he would have just "stood it" the rest of his life no matter how painful it was not having Jack in it anymore. Perhaps I'm just a pessimist but despite the fact that in the SS Ennis did continue to find a great deal of comfort from recurrent dreams of Jack (hence in a sense Jack is still very much present and alive in Ennis' life) Ennis ultimately ends up living the very tragic life that I believe jack wanted to save Ennis and himself from. To me this story will always be a great tragedy no matter how many spins we put on the ending or on the transformation of Ennis as a person at the end of the movie. Life trudges on as we all well know and to lose someone so important will always remain a source of pain, and knowing that nobody could nor will ever replace that one lost is cause for further sadness and despair.
...
where Ennis buttons up the shirt and stares with tear filled eyes at the memory of perhaps his only true source of peace makes it difficult for me to watch as I believe all the emotions and thoughts that he was feeling and being flooded with at that moment would be what he experienced each time he thinks of Jack and their past together, he would always be caught in a sort of blissful pain. Yet in truth isn't that what life is, a melange of joy and sadness, hope and despair, dreams and regrets? In a sense Ennis lives life to the fullest whenever he recalls a memory of Jack or their time together. If Ennis had never met Jack on Brokeback Mountain, he most likely would have walked through life more or less asleep, just taking one step after another in a direction which was chosen for him by convention. I feel he would have loved Alma and his children but were it not for Jack, Ennis may never have known what it was to love and be loved so deeply and unconditionally nor that such a pure form of love was even possible in this life!^
If you read the short story you will see that after Jack's death Ennis grows old and is simply trying to survive, he is again jobless and soon to be homeless, yet despite all these hardships he is still "standing it" but he is not just existing and resigned to his fate, he is actually living, still working at and striving to grab on to the fine strands of happiness which find their way into his bleak life through his dreams of Jack! Yes he may experience deep sadness and loneliness whenever he is reminded of the life he could never have with Jack but the short story tells us quite the opposite, that the thought of Jack, seeing Jack in his dreams is and will be till the day he dies the fire that warms Ennis' soul and gives him the strength to endure. We endure, we live, that is what people do even in the face of great pain and hardship. That is what I believe became of Ennis after Jack dies, instead of just trudging through life without sense nor purpose, he "lives on" and that certainly can be an inspiration for anyone who continues to live after losing the love of their life. Ennis may still be that lonely shabby old man in the bar but that is not all he is. Ennis is also a man who has truly lived and is still afire with regrets and sadness, memories of peace and joy, hopes and nights of dreams where he can find his beloved Jack.
I think this is a much more positive posting indeed. Hope anyone who reads it can understand what I am trying to convey! The story still moves me to tears but I don't despair and feel so hopeless as i have in the past.
For me, it is hard to think about it -- in spite of the sliver of hope, I see a lot of darkness and loneliness. A part of me wants to see otherwise...
For me, it is hard to think about it -- in spite of the sliver of hope, I see a lot of darkness and loneliness. A part of me wants to see otherwise...
Yes,I have usually seen the situation in that way too...But this doesn't mean that one couldn't live with the happiness for having felt the love of one's life.One can be optimist or pessimistic,or better said; positivist or negativist.To cry for what one has lived and has lost or to cry for never having been able to lived it.Or be happy in the present time for having lived it in the past...It depends on the way one sees the experience;I repeat,seeing the bottle half empty or half full.
It's been so long am not sure, but, I believe it was Ethan, on another thread, who noted Ennis was, at the end, fixing up the numbers on his mailbox, i.e., looking to whatever life would bring along. He clearly would never forget Jack, and even made Jack the foundation of his life from then on, with sadness AND joy. [Ethan, if I remember correctly, was encouraging someone in the "How BBM affected me", type threads].
That particular scene, then, and Ennis' apparent psychological health, as he fixed up his mailbox, added to his willingness to commit to his daughter's emotional needs, suggests a more mixed future for him than would be found in the short story.
I think what you guys say is true, and that final encounter in the movie between him and Alma Jr. is a great example. Ennis has been seen to do things to make his daughters happy before such as when they were little and asked him to come back in time to take them to a church function or watch them perform or something of that sort, he said "ok" he would actually try and make it back in time for that b/c it would meant something to them even though it meant cutting his time with Jack short. But yes when Alma Jr. asked if he could come to the wedding and he started to give reasons for not coming, she gave that same look we'd seen before where she can't really look at him and does not want him to see her disappointment. But Ennis now knows better to cherish the opportunities he has to make people he loves happy by fulfilling their requests. I think he does deeply regret not being able to do that for Jack to the degree Jack had wanted..... I'm not sure if Jack were still alive that Ennis would be able to commit to living out the rest of his life with Jack since we know those demons probably haunt Ennis till the day he dies, but we do see a glimmer of hope that Ennis has somehow learned to "change his ways". Even at the ripe old age of 40! Its strange b/c 40 is not that old yet Ennis somehow looked like he was in his 60's at that point....I guess he had a really tough life, not just physically but emotionally and psychologically speaking he struggled a long long time......Interesting post,lebeaugars ¡ :clap: I also think that,somehow,the lesson-horrible lesson,btw...-for Ennis was learning to live according to his feelings,letting them flow more freely than before.You know that they say we never learn from good and kind things that happen to us,but for the negative and sad ones...And doubtless,this is one of the most horrible events that Ennis could have overcame in his life,but at least,it had the positive-to call it in some way...-side of putting events in the correct order.I suppose we won't ever know for sure what would have happenned being Jack alive after the another good lesson that FC meant; you're right in that his inner demons would have been by his side during all his life,and probably more still living with another man...But it's sure that something would have changed inside him that allowed him to live a more relaxed life,and above all,where he would give his beloved ones the time both in quality and quantity,they deserved.Even if the inner suffering had became him in a older man in his look and,maybe a little,in his behaviour...
the simple fact of having lived such a happy times with him, the feeling of having lived a great love story can be enough for him to be happy or at least, resigned. .......... Only the "lucky ones" who have lived such a great love can understand what this means.Yes, he did have something, to carry forward in his life. It could not all be misery and grieving. Very, true, MPJ.
Yes,I have usually seen the situation in that way too...But this doesn't mean that one couldn't live with the happiness for having felt the love of one's life.One can be optimist or pessimistic,or better said; positivist or negativist.To cry for what one has lived and has lost or to cry for never having been able to lived it.Or be happy in the present time for having lived it in the past...It depends on the way one sees the experience;I repeat,seeing the bottle half empty or half full.
For a while I wasn't able to watch the last scene at all. I felt a physical pain... OK, not only for that scene, but that one was excruciating.... :(
The very reason that this story/movie touched us so much IS in Ennis's sorrow after losing the only meaning of his life... :_( :_(
I think what you guys say is true, and that final encounter in the movie between him and Alma Jr. is a great example. ...
If there ia any way for me to describe the end, it is BITTERSWEET. It is moving, wistful, hopeful, and deeply sad all at the same time.
What we see as pain, hurt, sadness, despair, they were programmed to expect in life.
“Life is hard, then you die” Ennis Del Mar.
Yes... and the fact that they never tasted the real love and acceptance , except from each other, makes me even sadder for both boys..
. . . So much explained with so few words, probably one of the elements that makes her such a great writer!You bet!
yeah, loreen I know, but 'course it's a real "half-empty/half-full" conundrum. For me, knowing that they found the love of their life, given who, where, an' when they were, is nuthin' short of a miracle. Many folk in them parts never even got that much out of what was gonna' be a tough life no matter how it's sliced.