Brokeback Mountain Forum @ ennisjack.com
The Movie & Story => Characters, Quotes & Scenes => Topic started by: camom on Jan 24, 2006, 10:27 PM
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This has probably been brought up somewhere, but I can't find it. I'd like to hear what people think would've happened if Ennis and Jack just had Brokeback, and nothing after that. To me, Jack was clearly gay/homosexual, and I think his encounters would have continued, using his marriage as a cover, but I'm not so sure about Ennis. Do you think he would've found another male lover, or was Jack the only man for him? Do you think he could've been happily married to Alma if Jack hadn't shown up?
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Then you would not have a story.
I'm just trying to get beyond the final shirt scene.
To me everything else before is writ in stone.
The author stated that she will not write a sequel (my understanding) the story is finished, done, no sequel, NO re-write. She feels that we, each in our own way, finish the story. And look at this forum - look at everyone's stories. I guess I'm saying that Jack and Ennis's story continues in our hearts.
In the future this movie will be the standard that every movie of this genre will be compared to....but never excell.
Kind of sad, don't you think?
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This has probably been brought up somewhere, but I can't find it. I'd like to hear what people think would've happened if Ennis and Jack just had Brokeback, and nothing after that. To me, Jack was clearly gay/homosexual, and I think his encounters would have continued, using his marriage as a cover, but I'm not so sure about Ennis. Do you think he would've found another male lover, or was Jack the only man for him? Do you think he could've been happily married to Alma if Jack hadn't shown up?
Before I say anything, I should say that all of what I am about to say is speculation on my part.
Ennis would have probably lived a less eventful life, but he would have had been forever tormented for having lost Jack. He probably would have remained married, but is is possible that the sadness and unfulfilled passion within him would have inevitably taken its toll on the marriage.
Jack would have continued seeking to connect with other men, but I think he would have been equally tormented for having lost Ennis. He would probably have been condemned to a life of forever searching for that lost ideal, never finding it the way he 'came home' with Ennis. Finally, I believe that Jack would have met the same end...
Then again, you ask yourself: could they have withstood being forever apart?
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This has probably been brought up somewhere, but I can't find it. I'd like to hear what people think would've happened if Ennis and Jack just had Brokeback, and nothing after that. To me, Jack was clearly gay/homosexual, and I think his encounters would have continued, using his marriage as a cover, but I'm not so sure about Ennis. Do you think he would've found another male lover, or was Jack the only man for him? Do you think he could've been happily married to Alma if Jack hadn't shown up?
Before I say anything, I should say that all of what I am about to say is speculation on my part.
Ennis would have probably lived a less eventful life, but he would have had been forever tormented for having lost Jack. He probably would have remained married, but is is possible that the sadness and unfulfilled passion within him would have inevitably taken its toll on the marriage.
Jack would have continued seeking to connect with other men, but I think he would have been equally tormented for having lost Ennis. He would probably have been condemned to a life of forever searching for that lost ideal, never finding it the way he 'came home' with Ennis. Finally, I believe that Jack would have met the same end...
Then again, you ask yourself: could they have withstood being forever apart?
My feeling is without Jack, Ennis would have sort of sleep walked through his life. Sunk further.
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The author stated that she will not write a sequel (my understanding) the story is finished, done, no sequel, NO re-write.
A poem is never finished, only abandoned. - Paul Valery (1871 - 1945).
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Excellent quote! I think with Jack and Ennis it must feel done for Annie Proulx though, it was hard for her to write she said, and she was sad. I mean we all are, don't you want to go back and rewrite it? But we can't... *sigh*
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Maybe in the future we will see an Annie Proullx story that fulfills our need for closure or another story not connected at all with "Brokeback Mountain" that gives us what we all want viscerally, after all this "brokeback" I need a release.
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This has probably been brought up somewhere, but I can't find it. I'd like to hear what people think would've happened if Ennis and Jack just had Brokeback, and nothing after that. To me, Jack was clearly gay/homosexual, and I think his encounters would have continued, using his marriage as a cover, but I'm not so sure about Ennis. Do you think he would've found another male lover, or was Jack the only man for him? Do you think he could've been happily married to Alma if Jack hadn't shown up?
Before I say anything, I should say that all of what I am about to say is speculation on my part.
Ennis would have probably lived a less eventful life, but he would have had been forever tormented for having lost Jack. He probably would have remained married, but is is possible that the sadness and unfulfilled passion within him would have inevitably taken its toll on the marriage.
Jack would have continued seeking to connect with other men, but I think he would have been equally tormented for having lost Ennis. He would probably have been condemned to a life of forever searching for that lost ideal, never finding it the way he 'came home' with Ennis. Finally, I believe that Jack would have met the same end...
Then again, you ask yourself: could they have withstood being forever apart?
My feeling is without Jack, Ennis would have sort of sleep walked through his life. Sunk further.
I like the way you put that--sleepwalking through life. That makes a lot of sense to me.
camom
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It is just unthinkable.
One way or another they would have found eachother again, if only by accident.
Fate would have brought them together again.
I know it, I just know it!
Jim
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There are some things that are just meant to be. No one said it better than Annie Proulx:
"While I was working on this story, I was occasionally close to tears. I felt guilty that their lives were so difficult, yet there was nothing I could do about it. It couldn't end any other way."
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I agree with others, there would not have been a story.
But, the really cool thing about is the author refuses to acknowledge a sequel, and that is an admirable concept. The story is not finished until it is read. Now we have to finish it. Alright, in my opinion Ennis's marriage would have ultimately failed whether Jack and Ennis reconnected or not. Somebody wrote a 'sleeping walking thru life' line. Wow! what a metaphor. Alma never really liked the country life and she needed people more than Ennis, and once she got around them, she did fine. Alma and Ennis were just not going to make it long term.
The real question in my mind is speculating how Ennis chooses to live the rest of his life? He lost the love of his life. (period) He was a man of few resources, and changing that situation was not easy or even foreseeable. This weighs heavy on the prospects of change. I think in a lot of ways, this was due to his education, his bumpy upbringing and given his own devices, he would not have pursued living the cards he was truly dealt. He would just have to 'stand it.' This is very different from Jack. Some have attributed this difference to the degree of gayness and even wonder whether Ennis is gay. To me this story is clearly about two repressed gay men. One somewhat more (repressed) than the other. The result of this is Jack had more resources and was proactive about his situation. It is unfortunate that some see Jack a "gayer" due to this difference. I think this assessment may even really misunderstand Ennis and a major message of the story.
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To me, Jack was clearly gay/homosexual, and I think his encounters would have continued, using his marriage as a cover,...
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I agree with you about Jack. There is no way this could have been his first sexual encounter.
I don't know about anyone else but my first time catching did not bring a smile to my face like it did Jack. ;)
...but I'm not so sure about Ennis. Do you think he would've found another male lover, or was Jack the only man for him?
No, I don't think Ennis would have found anyone else. He didn't look at all. He was quite satisfied with the situation as it was. Well, maybe not satisfied, but it was as far as he was willing to go because of his fears. [As I see it]
Do you think he could've been happily married to Alma if Jack hadn't shown up?
No. There was that part of him that could not truly love someone else until Jack showed up and Ennis discovered it.
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Ennis would have continued Bt fking his wife -- never daring to touch another man, all the while lusting after Jack in his heart. Jack would have become a frequent patron of the gay bar Scene in Dallas --Lureen would get even more bitter and wear even more bad makeup with big hair.
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Ennis would have continued Bt fking his wife -- never daring to touch another man, all the while lusting after Jack in his heart. Jack would have become a frequent patron of the gay bar Scene in Dallas --Lureen would get even more bitter and wear even more bad makeup with big hair.
Well, We certainly are the lucky ones, aren't we? I mean, ...poor Alma wouldn't be able to sit down by this time. ...and Jack would be a Dallas drag queen (and none too pretty). Lureen, poor Lureen, god knows Tammy Fay would be jealous (the higher the hair, the closer to god). Ennis wouldn't have spoken a word in years. and they would all be guests on the Springer Show! Now, aren't you glad that Jack found Ennis?
Jim
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I agree with most of the posts here. Ennis would have kept to his word about it being a "one shot thing" - a lot like guys who messed around with their buddies while in grade school end up getting married and having kids, never returning to that "discovery" period in their lives. I think the reason Ennis became smitten with Jack was that Jack offered himself to Ennis. He made Ennis feel like a man, by succumbing to be the receiver in the tent scene. There was no one around on the mountain to challenge basic instinct and desire. No "societal pressure" to extinguish their feelings before they happened. Both guys were at their peak (19 years old each) when they had their encounter. It's almost like being in prison or an all-boys school in England. There were no girls around. They were lonely. They were both handsome. They were both friends first. And they were gentle souls (at least when they first met). All of these circumstances came together in the right mix of time and place to help spark what happened between them. I don't think Ennis was gay. I think he sort of fell into it. But since he maintained the traditional "male" role (and I'm assuming this here based on personality and clues here and there), he was ok with it. He just never knew how hard he would eventually fall for Jack. THAT is what makes this movie so heartfelt.
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Well, We certainly are the lucky ones, aren't we? I mean, ...poor Alma wouldn't be able to sit down by this time. ...and Jack would be a Dallas drag queen (and none too pretty). Lureen, poor Lureen, god knows Tammy Fay would be jealous (the higher the hair, the closer to god). Ennis wouldn't have spoken a word in years. and they would all be guests on the Springer Show! Now, aren't you glad that Jack found Ennis?
Jim
When you put it that way...eek...guess it's a good thing the story went the way it did! ;)