Topic: Quotes from the short story

[Patriot1]

I don't have the book here but I was wondering if I remember correctly.  In the book isn't Jack the one who says "this is a one shot thing we got going here" (or something like that) after their FNIT?

No, Ennis says that Boo_Boo.  Then Jack says, "It's nobody's business but ours."

[boo_boo]

I don't have the book here but I was wondering if I remember correctly.  In the book isn't Jack the one who says "this is a one shot thing we got going here" (or something like that) after their FNIT?

No, Ennis says that Boo_Boo.  Then Jack says, "It's nobody's business but ours."

Okay.  I thought I read in the book that Jack said it & I was wondering why they changed it in the movie.  Thanks so much!

[Jack Nasty]

Nothing marred it, even the knowledge that Ennis would not then embrace him face to face because he did not want to see nor feel that it was Jack he held

There were quotes both in the story and movie that, for me, were a little difficult to understand.  But the above quote made no sence to me at all.

Here we have two boys hugging and kissing.  Book or movie doesn't say, but I don't think they only did it in the doggy position.  Those things mean Jack and Ennis faced each other. 

Why would Ennis, then, find it so difficult to face Jack to hug him?  He has already been as intimate as two people can get, but he can't hug Jack from the front because he doesn't want to know it is another boy he is hugging?  This makes no sense to me at all.  Can anyone explain it to me?

This confused me a bit, too. I think the conclusion I finally reached was that any other time they'd been (intimately) face-to-face were during moments of passion, when it didn't really matter that they were both boys. But this little scene is just an uninspired moment of tenderness, where Jack was half-asleep and Ennis wasn't really looking for anything beyond being able to hold Jack. That passage does still make me unhappy, though. Then again, Ennis in general makes me unhappy sometimes. Thinking more in-depth about this now, I guess this was sort of a big step for Ennis, just holding Jack when it wasn't really necessary, and that IS a big step for him...maybe facing Jack was too big of a step. Baby steps, baby steps...

[NoReins]

I don't have the book here but I was wondering if I remember correctly.  In the book isn't Jack the one who says "this is a one shot thing we got going here" (or something like that) after their FNIT?

No, Ennis says that Boo_Boo.  Then Jack says, "It's nobody's business but ours."

Not so Patriot1 - in the short story it's Jack who says it. I don't have my copy with me so apologies for the words being jumbled but it goes something like this...

"They never talked about the sex, let it happen, at first only in the tent at night then in the day with the hot sun beating down and in the evening by the fire, plenty of noises but never saying a goddamn word except once when Ennis said 'I ain't queer' and Jack replied quickly 'Neither am I. A one shot thing. Nobody's business but ours'"

Not sure why they changed this for the movie....

[Patriot1]

I don't have the book here but I was wondering if I remember correctly.  In the book isn't Jack the one who says "this is a one shot thing we got going here" (or something like that) after their FNIT?

No, Ennis says that Boo_Boo.  Then Jack says, "It's nobody's business but ours."

Not so Patriot1 - in the short story it's Jack who says it. I don't have my copy with me so apologies for the words being jumbled but it goes something like this...

"They never talked about the sex, let it happen, at first only in the tent at night then in the day with the hot sun beating down and in the evening by the fire, plenty of noises but never saying a goddamn word except once when Ennis said 'I ain't queer' and Jack replied quickly 'Neither am I. A one shot thing. Nobody's business but ours'"

Not sure why they changed this for the movie....

Well I'll be dipped in honey and licked all over.  You are correct NoReins.  I looked at the screenplay not the story.  Boo_Boo I am sorry I gave you wrong information.  My Bad.

[boo_boo]

I don't have the book here but I was wondering if I remember correctly.  In the book isn't Jack the one who says "this is a one shot thing we got going here" (or something like that) after their FNIT?

No, Ennis says that Boo_Boo.  Then Jack says, "It's nobody's business but ours."

Not so Patriot1 - in the short story it's Jack who says it. I don't have my copy with me so apologies for the words being jumbled but it goes something like this...

"They never talked about the sex, let it happen, at first only in the tent at night then in the day with the hot sun beating down and in the evening by the fire, plenty of noises but never saying a goddamn word except once when Ennis said 'I ain't queer' and Jack replied quickly 'Neither am I. A one shot thing. Nobody's business but ours'"

Not sure why they changed this for the movie....

Well I'll be dipped in honey and licked all over.  You are correct NoReins.  I looked at the screenplay not the story.  Boo_Boo I am sorry I gave you wrong information.  My Bad.

That's okay.  I get the book & movie confused all the time!  Was Jack just saying that to cover up his feelings for Ennis?  That throws a whole different spin on the scene to me.

[NoReins]

Before I reply boo_boo, I think I should get the quote right now that I've got my copy of the story here...

They never talked about the sex, let it happen, at first only in the tent at night, then in the full daylight with the hot sun striking down, and at evening in the fire glow, quick, rough, laughing and snorting, no lack of noises, but saying not a goddamn word except once Ennis said "I'm not no queer", and Jack jumped in with "Me neither. A one-shot thing. Nobody's business but ours"

I think the key phrase (and the reason I felt I should reproduce the quote properly) is "Jack jumped in". I think that Jack was trying to make Ennis relax about what was happening, knowing that Ennis was still very unsure and edgy about their relationship, knowing that if he (Jack) said he was queer then Ennis would most likely back off completely. Even though the words come out of different mouths in the movie, this feeling is still the same - watch Jake's face when he says the "Me neither" line because he plays it to perfection, responding quickly then flashing a quick glance at Ennis to see if he's picked up on the lie.

[boo_boo]

Before I reply boo_boo, I think I should get the quote right now that I've got my copy of the story here...

They never talked about the sex, let it happen, at first only in the tent at night, then in the full daylight with the hot sun striking down, and at evening in the fire glow, quick, rough, laughing and snorting, no lack of noises, but saying not a goddamn word except once Ennis said "I'm not no queer", and Jack jumped in with "Me neither. A one-shot thing. Nobody's business but ours"

I think the key phrase (and the reason I felt I should reproduce the quote properly) is "Jack jumped in". I think that Jack was trying to make Ennis relax about what was happening, knowing that Ennis was still very unsure and edgy about their relationship, knowing that if he (Jack) said he was queer then Ennis would most likely back off completely. Even though the words come out of different mouths in the movie, this feeling is still the same - watch Jake's face when he says the "Me neither" line because he plays it to perfection, responding quickly then flashing a quick glance at Ennis to see if he's picked up on the lie.

I can see that.  I was trying to wrap my brain around why the book had Jack saying it but the movie had Ennis saying it.

[NoReins]

I can see that.  I was trying to wrap my brain around why the book had Jack saying it but the movie had Ennis saying it.

Yeah, I've wondered about that too. I think it's maybe something to do with not wanting to lead with the "I ain't queer" line? Like, a need to show the audience that there were feelings there that couldn't be denied, despite them "not being queer". Said this way round, it seems to me that it's more of an "I'm attracted to you, you're attracted to me, there's something there, but we're not queer" whereas the other way round it's "I'm not queer, you're not queer, but we're doing this anyway"....and I'm thinking the distinction is between feelings/emotions/love and just sex for the sake of it ('cos there's no-one else there)?

I dunno.....

[boo_boo]

I can see that.  I was trying to wrap my brain around why the book had Jack saying it but the movie had Ennis saying it.

Yeah, I've wondered about that too. I think it's maybe something to do with not wanting to lead with the "I ain't queer" line? Like, a need to show the audience that there were feelings there that couldn't be denied, despite them "not being queer". Said this way round, it seems to me that it's more of an "I'm attracted to you, you're attracted to me, there's something there, but we're not queer" whereas the other way round it's "I'm not queer, you're not queer, but we're doing this anyway"....and I'm thinking the distinction is between feelings/emotions/love and just sex for the sake of it ('cos there's no-one else there)?

I dunno.....

I never thought of it that way but that totally makes sense. 

[guyinjax]

fave-fave passage as it evokes so much tenderness and melancholy and that transcendent state we're frozen in when we look at the world for the first time and realise its tremendous vastness and depth and myriad of colours glowing with the pulse of life, symbolic of all that which is beautiful (and can hurt) between two humans in this life:

They had stood that way for a long time in front of the fire, its burning tossing ruddy chunks of light, the shadow of their bodies a single column against the rock. The minutes ticked by from the round watch in Ennis's pocket, from the sticks in the fire settling into coals. Stars bit through the wavy heat layers above the fire. Ennis's breath came slow and quiet, he hummed, rocked a little in the sparklight and Jack leaned against the steady heartbeat, the vibrations of the humming like faint electricity and, standing, he fell into sleep that was not sleep but something else drowsy and tranced (...) Later, that dozy embrace solidified in his memory as the single moment of artless, charmed happiness in their separate and difficult lives.

perfect, simply perfect

[Valandil Eluch]

i agree perfect

[ms.bluesky]

i think she did that to get us ready for the big sex scene maybe

[Karol]

Thanks so much for this topic.
I come from Italy and so I knew only the italian version of the short story.
It's exciting read part of the original one.


 

[lzara23]

"Later, that dozy embrace solidified in his memory as the single moment of artless, charmed happiness in their separate and difficult lives. Nothing marred it, even the knowledge that Ennis would not then embrace him face to face because he did not want to see nor feel that it was Jack he held. And maybe, he thought, they'd never got much farther than that."

Hi! This is not my favourite, but it's really interesting... I just don't know what this means...  I've read it both in spanish and english but it is the same, what interpretation do you give to this?

[rimasworld]

Hi! This is not my favourite, but it's really interesting... I just don't know what this means...  I've read it both in spanish and english but it is the same, what interpretation do you give to this?

I think maybe it means that Ennis couldn't come to terms with his sexuality and he was always kind of at odds with himself. I think it took Jack's death and finding the shirts for him to really understand how much he had lost and how much he really did love Jack. Sadly, by then it was too late.

[FlwrChild]

I agree with rimasworld. I think it refers to Ennis' inner struggle with his sexuality and the truth that what they had together was not just some "thing" that grabbed hold of them but was actually a real relationship of love and affection and he'd always been taught that such a thing was wrong, wrong enough even to get a man killed. So in that passage Jack is reflecting about how holding him from behind might have been eaiser for Ennis because, at least for small moments, he might be able to forget that it was a man he held that way.


Here's a thought. Was that really how Ennis felt (as in was that the reason he preferred to hold Jack from behind) or was that simply Jack's interpretation? Maybe Ennis just liked the feel of holding Jack in his arms in a way that allowed Jack to lean back into him or maybe he liked the way they fit together in that position. Or maybe it was because he couldn't bear to look the truth face on. Who knows? Just throwing that nugget out there for contemplation....