Topic: Leaving Brokeback Moutain - possible spoilers

[edgar]

Probably OT, but I like the idea of the compass. It made me think of Donne's poem - "Thy firmness makes my circle just/And makes me end where I began." Ennis is the centre for Jack, to which he always returns, and I think as they leave the mountain that's what he thinks - that this won't be the end. Jack's an optimist...and Jack's in love.

Our two souls therefore, which are one, 
Though I must go, endure not yet 
A breach, but an expansion, 
Like gold to aery thinness beat. 

If they be two, they are two so                                 
As stiff twin compasses are two ; 
Thy soul, the fix'd foot, makes no show 
To move, but doth, if th' other do. 

Wow, welshwitch and tpe. This poem is extremely appropriate. Donne wrote it to his wife before leaving on a trip. WW, you're right, it is Ennis who is the stationary foot, while Jack does the traveling. Lightning flat....Texas... even.........Mexico. Jack travels but he does not, cannot, will not travel so far as to be free of Ennis's influence.
Some have said that surely Jack's last thoughts were of Ennis. Even in that last journey he stayed joined to Ennis.

[tpe]

Probably OT, but I like the idea of the compass. It made me think of Donne's poem - "Thy firmness makes my circle just/And makes me end where I began." Ennis is the centre for Jack, to which he always returns, and I think as they leave the mountain that's what he thinks - that this won't be the end. Jack's an optimist...and Jack's in love.

Our two souls therefore, which are one, 
Though I must go, endure not yet 
A breach, but an expansion, 
Like gold to aery thinness beat. 

If they be two, they are two so                                 
As stiff twin compasses are two ; 
Thy soul, the fix'd foot, makes no show 
To move, but doth, if th' other do. 

Wow, welshwitch and tpe. This poem is extremely appropriate. Donne wrote it to his wife before leaving on a trip. WW, you're right, it is Ennis who is the stationary foot, while Jack does the traveling. Lightning flat....Texas... even.........Mexico. Jack travels but he does not, cannot, will not travel so far as to be free of Ennis's influence.
Some have said that surely Jack's last thoughts were of Ennis. Even in that last journey he stayed joined to Ennis.

Indeed, this deeper insight is all welshwitch's.  Like you, I cannot help but be moved to react in a way that does this justice.

 

[goblondie]

I think that both Jack and Ennis' reactions were on the mark... this is the Jack before illicit fishing trips, complicated lies and bitter disappointment. He's still a little boy in some ways and is sure he'll see Ennis again and I'm guessing that's why he's so calm at their parting, whereas Ennis has already had somewhat of a hardknock life and understands that things won't be that simple. As usual, he expresses his emotions through violence. I guess what I'm saying here is that although it seems kinda like a role reversal (Jack mellow about having to leave Ennis, Ennis being the more emotional one) it somehow seems to work.

I think youre right Natalia, Jack is so much in love with Ennis that he cant imagine not seeing Ennis again. Another possibility could be that he already reacted and either Ennis or us saw it, rememer that Jack was packing the tent as Ennis joined him, we dont know if he had been sad or crying before Ennis came.
Maybe he really didnt realise how serious situation was until Ennis hit him in the fight,must have been a chock and wakeup call for Jack he looked so unhappy.We all know it was after the fight he stole Ennis shirt, maybe he then had a feeling he would never see Ennis again ,and therefor at least wanted Ennis shirt with his smell and blood as a memory.

[manhattangirl]

Ennis and Jack, indeed had different views at the premature ending of their summer.  To Ennis, this was the ending of the most happiest time of his life, and the person who gave it him was someone he'll never see again.  The friendship, the beginning of love, the sex, it was over.  Ennis was angry and upset.  He'll never see his Jack again.  And maybe anger at Jack, didn't he understand what this means?  And his reactions towards Jack was an ending, striking out at Jack, cutting it off, moving on to Alma.

I don't think Jack was that fatalistic, yes, their summer on Brokeback was over, but not them.   Ennis made him see differently, that's why he never pushed Ennis, just ask him would he be back.   Jack always took his ques from Ennis's actions.   

[tpe]

I think Jack was always good at hiding his frue feelings: witness the post-divorce meeting, where he was able (by and large) to smother his true feelings of hurt and disappointment. 

Jack must have been as sad as Ennis -- it shows by his understanding of what Ennis was going through and his approaching him the way he did.

[manhattangirl]

Smothering or adjusting, Ennis must have seen the disappointment in Jack's face every time he let him down.  Jack always adjusted to Ennis state of mind at whatever point he was in his life.   

[tpe]

Smothering or adjusting, Ennis must have seen the disappointment in Jack's face every time he let him down.  Jack always adjusted to Ennis state of mind at whatever point he was in his life.   

Yes, no matter how hard Jack tried to hide his feelings, I think Ennis understood.  Eve in this scene before they start the journey down the mountain, he understood that Jack "horsing around" was an attempt to hide his true feelings -- and Ennis would have none of this.  He had no intention of letting it go with a laugh.

[Toadily]

There is a great line in "Field of Dreams" where Dr Graham Burt Lancaster says " You know we just don't recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, well, there'll be other days. I didn't realize that that was the only day."

I think Jack really didn't realize how life would be down the mount.  Ennis was more "realistic" that way.  I know that I have said goodbye to people who really mattered to me thinking it was just a new step, I would see them a lot but you don't. 

[LuvJackNasty]

There is a great line in "Field of Dreams" where Dr Graham Burt Lancaster says " You know we just don't recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, well, there'll be other days. I didn't realize that that was the only day."

I think Jack really didn't realize how life would be down the mount.  Ennis was more "realistic" that way.  I know that I have said goodbye to people who really mattered to me thinking it was just a new step, I would see them a lot but you don't. 

God that made me tear up  :\'(

[tpe]

There is a great line in "Field of Dreams" where Dr Graham Burt Lancaster says " You know we just don't recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, well, there'll be other days. I didn't realize that that was the only day."

I think Jack really didn't realize how life would be down the mount.  Ennis was more "realistic" that way.  I know that I have said goodbye to people who really mattered to me thinking it was just a new step, I would see them a lot but you don't. 

Sometimes, it is best to be open-ended, because there is always the hope to meeting each other again, no matter how remote.

When Jack and Ennis said goodbye in 63, there was almost a finality to it all.  Both seemed to think that they would never see each other again.   And yet, you could tell from subsequent events (specifically, Jack inquiring about Ennis the next summer) that not all hope had been extinguished.

[welshwitch]

And when you think about it, they hadn't absolutely no idea of the other's location. Ennis knew Jack's family home was in Lightning Flat, which he has no trouble getting to at the end of the story. He also knows Jack is on the rodeo circuit and would be known to others on it. Jack knows where Ennis comes from, where his sister and brother are and that Ennis intends to get married at the end of the year, and he's not the type to up stakes and go off to make his fortune in LA or NY.  Jack is sure enough about Ennis's likely whereabouts to go back to Aguirre the next year and appear disappointed when he hears that Ennis hasn't returned, from which he might deduce that Ennis has settled somewhere in the area. He knows enough to be able to send the postcard in 1967.

[Toadily]

God that made me tear up  :\'(

yeah I love that line, I went to look it up to get it verbatim cause I love it so much.  Field of Dreams in general is very good that way.

[goblondie]

There is a great line in "Field of Dreams" where Dr Graham Burt Lancaster says " You know we just don't recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they're happening. Back then I thought, well, there'll be other days. I didn't realize that that was the only day."

I think Jack really didn't realize how life would be down the mount.  Ennis was more "realistic" that way.  I know that I have said goodbye to people who really mattered to me thinking it was just a new step, I would see them a lot but you don't. 

couldnt have said it better, very beautifull said.