Topic: What is the scene you dislike the most? (spoiler)

[JerBear418720]

2 scenes I didn't like:

1st was way at the beginning - Jack is leaning against his truck in Aguirre's parking lot.  He looks for all the world like a Halsted Street (Chicago Boystown) poser.  I though, "oh no, I hope this isn't what the movie is going to be like".  That evaporated fast, tho.

2nd is near the end when Ennis is in the phone booth talking to Lureen.  I thought his reaction was pretty flat and most un-Ennis-like.  I expected something more powerful - like a punch thru the glass or some animal-like moan.

This is all relative, tho.  99.9% of the movie is beautifully crafted. 

1) I thought Jack was already flirting with Ennis then... But I guess the two of them didn't know if both of them are going to selected for the job, if they were, Ennis would probably not be so cold.
Jack said, it was cut in the movie but it was in the trailer, "If we are going to work together, we better start drinking together."

2) Notice how Ennis gripped the handset close to his heart. Fear has gripped him at this point and he felt kinda numb and a little frightened.

I remember my eariler tom-cat wasn't doing so well after a big fight. He returned after two weeks, struggling. He wasn't meowing and couldn't eat much. Took him to the vet the following day and the vet said its best to put him down. At that time I didn't know what was going on even though I saw him stick his tongue out after the lethal injection. I sat outside the vet for a few hours, feeling numb... It was only until I got home at night and suddenly I cried for hours...

I can understand why Ennis didn't react as we would expect him to until the shirt scene which was the trigger point and I thought it was also the closure point for him to accept the reality.

Wow, cybernaut, thanks for your insights - esp #2 - its all clear to me now.  I remember when my father died I did not react at all - until about 4 months later when my then partner found me sitting in the shower sobbing.  His reaction was one of relief - he said:  "damn, its about time".

[cybernaut]

JerBear418720: Sorry to hear about your dad. What was the trigger point did you remember?

I remember my uncle wasn't in good shape when I was in the army. My mum took me and my sis one time during off-duty to see my shrunken uncle in the hospital, unconscious due to some illness even the doctors couldn't figure it out. Then suddenly one day, just like as he slipped into unconsciousness, he slipped away without saying goodbye.

I always thought it was one of the cruelest form of departure God can give.

On another story, I had witnessed an old guy fell from a stairwell of a double-decker bus, broke his shoulders and was sent home after the doctors found nothing wrong on him. He had a fun time with his family and grand-kids until I found out on an evening tabloid two days later, he had a brain haemorrhage and died. However he had the chance to say goodbye to his family and left quietly.  :'(

That story has always haunted me... that I prayed to God that I treat people well and also I have the chance to bid farewell to my loved ones before I leave. Thus I can feel what Ennis felt... that he nor Jack didn't have the chance to say goodbye and that's where it breaks my heart.  :'(

[JerBear418720]

JerBear418720: Sorry to hear about your dad. What was the trigger point did you remember?

I remember my uncle wasn't in good shape when I was in the army. My mum took me and my sis one time during off-duty to see my shrunken uncle in the hospital, unconscious due to some illness even the doctors couldn't figure it out. Then suddenly one day, just like as he slipped into unconsciousness, he slipped away without saying goodbye.

I always thought it was one of the cruelest form of departure God can give.

On another story, I had witnessed an old guy fell from a stairwell of a double-decker bus, broke his shoulders and was sent home after the doctors found nothing wrong on him. He had a fun time with his family and grand-kids until I found out on an evening tabloid two days later, he had a brain haemorrhage and died. However he had the chance to say goodbye to his family and left quietly.  :'(

That story has always haunted me... that I prayed to God that I treat people well and also I have the chance to bid farewell to my loved ones before I leave. Thus I can feel what Ennis felt... that he nor Jack didn't have the chance to say goodbye and that's where it breaks my heart.  :'(

My Dad had cancer and was ill for 6 months.  My mother cared for him in their home for the last 4.  We had a whole battalion of people that would come over to be with him when she went to work - my day was Sunday.  He and I had never gotten along, but in those 4 months of Sundays, we not only cleared the air but really got to know one another.  I discovered the amazing human being that was hidden behind alcoholism for many years (he did finally quit the year he died).

The morning I lost it in the shower, I was thinking about the terrible waste of being distanced from my father for almost 40 years.  Some of my tears were joyful tho - we didn't part ememies.

[*Froggy*]

My Dad had cancer and was ill for 6 months.  My mother cared for him in their home for the last 4.  We had a whole battalion of people that would come over to be with him when she went to work - my day was Sunday.  He and I had never gotten along, but in those 4 months of Sundays, we not only cleared the air but really got to know one another.  I discovered the amazing human being that was hidden behind alcoholism for many years (he did finally quit the year he died).

The morning I lost it in the shower, I was thinking about the terrible waste of being distanced from my father for almost 40 years.  Some of my tears were joyful tho - we didn't part ememies.

I'm so happy for you...I had a similar experience with my mother, though it was between her and her dad...I made her realise that once he was dead, that would be it, all the anger and hatred she had for that man would never be cleared. And finally she made the first move, contacted him, and they spoke, saw eachother a few times too, and he even asked to see her more. They had had a feud of over 30 years...she still feels like some things need to be cleared, but at least they have started the process.

[JerBear418720]

My Dad had cancer and was ill for 6 months.  My mother cared for him in their home for the last 4.  We had a whole battalion of people that would come over to be with him when she went to work - my day was Sunday.  He and I had never gotten along, but in those 4 months of Sundays, we not only cleared the air but really got to know one another.  I discovered the amazing human being that was hidden behind alcoholism for many years (he did finally quit the year he died).

The morning I lost it in the shower, I was thinking about the terrible waste of being distanced from my father for almost 40 years.  Some of my tears were joyful tho - we didn't part ememies.

I'm so happy for you...I had a similar experience with my mother, though it was between her and her dad...I made her realise that once he was dead, that would be it, all the anger and hatred she had for that man would never be cleared. And finally she made the first move, contacted him, and they spoke, saw eachother a few times too, and he even asked to see her more. They had had a feud of over 30 years...she still feels like some things need to be cleared, but at least they have started the process.

Froggie and cybernaut, I'm sitting here writing this in tears, because I can almost feel you both holding my hands.  I have terrible trouble being open about most everything - maybe that's why I feel so powerfully welded to Ennis - I SO understand him.  There is magic in this forum, ya know.   :'( :D

[*Froggy*]

Froggie and cybernaut, I'm sitting here writing this in tears, because I can almost feel you both holding my hands.  I have terrible trouble being open about most everything - maybe that's why I feel so powerfully welded to Ennis - I SO understand him.  There is magic in this forum, ya know.   :'( :D

Honey, I'll hold your hand anytime you want...cry with you even. If posting here helps, then keep typing There are bits of Ennis and Jack in all of us, my guess is that it is why we are all so moved by BBM!
There is magic and love on this forum, and I'm so happy to have found it!

  Froggy

[chameau]

My Dad had cancer and was ill for 6 months.  My mother cared for him in their home for the last 4.  We had a whole battalion of people that would come over to be with him when she went to work - my day was Sunday.  He and I had never gotten along, but in those 4 months of Sundays, we not only cleared the air but really got to know one another.  I discovered the amazing human being that was hidden behind alcoholism for many years (he did finally quit the year he died).

The morning I lost it in the shower, I was thinking about the terrible waste of being distanced from my father for almost 40 years.  Some of my tears were joyful tho - we didn't part ememies.

I'm so happy for you...I had a similar experience with my mother, though it was between her and her dad...I made her realise that once he was dead, that would be it, all the anger and hatred she had for that man would never be cleared. And finally she made the first move, contacted him, and they spoke, saw eachother a few times too, and he even asked to see her more. They had had a feud of over 30 years...she still feels like some things need to be cleared, but at least they have started the process.

Froggie and cybernaut, I'm sitting here writing this in tears, because I can almost feel you both holding my hands.  I have terrible trouble being open about most everything - maybe that's why I feel so powerfully welded to Ennis - I SO understand him.  There is magic in this forum, ya know.   :'( :D

 :'(

There is magic in this forum, ya know.

Big time!

Thanks all for sharing!

[JerBear418720]

JerBear418720: Sorry to hear about your dad. What was the trigger point did you remember?

I remember my uncle wasn't in good shape when I was in the army. My mum took me and my sis one time during off-duty to see my shrunken uncle in the hospital, unconscious due to some illness even the doctors couldn't figure it out. Then suddenly one day, just like as he slipped into unconsciousness, he slipped away without saying goodbye.

I always thought it was one of the cruelest form of departure God can give.

On another story, I had witnessed an old guy fell from a stairwell of a double-decker bus, broke his shoulders and was sent home after the doctors found nothing wrong on him. He had a fun time with his family and grand-kids until I found out on an evening tabloid two days later, he had a brain haemorrhage and died. However he had the chance to say goodbye to his family and left quietly.  :'(

That story has always haunted me... that I prayed to God that I treat people well and also I have the chance to bid farewell to my loved ones before I leave. Thus I can feel what Ennis felt... that he nor Jack didn't have the chance to say goodbye and that's where it breaks my heart.  :'(

Cybernaut, just remember that when people go more quickly, it is a blessing to them because they don't suffer as much.  If they have done a good job with relationships, goodbyes are almost understood, because their outpouring of love speaks for itself.  Maybe the way you die is pre-ordained.  If you have damaged relationships, hopefully, you're granted the time to fix them.  I think about this a lot, because near the end of 2004, I was diagnosed with a very slow-moving type of leukemia.  No worries, doc gave me 5-10 years, and I have yet to need treatment.  I'm not saying this to start a pity party - I'm saying this because it is probably an indication that I have a LOT of work to do.  I've mostly recently reached out to a young man that loved me for 3 years - we broke up a month before my diagnosis.  I told him that I still love him and that I want him back.  He told me that his feelings have not diminished despite the 16 months we have been apart.  I can only hope.....

[*Froggy*]

Cybernaut, just remember that when people go more quickly, it is a blessing to them because they don't suffer as much.  If they have done a good job with relationships, goodbyes are almost understood, because their outpouring of love speaks for itself.  Maybe the way you die is pre-ordained.  If you have damaged relationships, hopefully, you're granted the time to fix them.  I think about this a lot, because near the end of 2004, I was diagnosed with a very slow-moving type of leukemia.  No worries, doc gave me 5-10 years, and I have yet to need treatment.  I'm not saying this to start a pity party - I'm saying this because it is probably an indication that I have a LOT of work to do.  I've mostly recently reached out to a young man that loved me for 3 years - we broke up a month before my diagnosis.  I told him that I still love him and that I want him back.  He told me that his feelings have not diminished despite the 16 months we have been apart.  I can only hope.....

All the best to you...and fingers crossed for getting your man back! Moua

[cybernaut]

Cybernaut, just remember that when people go more quickly, it is a blessing to them because they don't suffer as much.  If they have done a good job with relationships, goodbyes are almost understood, because their outpouring of love speaks for itself.  Maybe the way you die is pre-ordained.  If you have damaged relationships, hopefully, you're granted the time to fix them.  I think about this a lot, because near the end of 2004, I was diagnosed with a very slow-moving type of leukemia.  No worries, doc gave me 5-10 years, and I have yet to need treatment.  I'm not saying this to start a pity party - I'm saying this because it is probably an indication that I have a LOT of work to do.  I've mostly recently reached out to a young man that loved me for 3 years - we broke up a month before my diagnosis.  I told him that I still love him and that I want him back.  He told me that his feelings have not diminished despite the 16 months we have been apart.  I can only hope.....

*Hugz* :'(

Do whatever you need to bring him back. Cybie is supporting you! 

[JerBear418720]

Cybernaut, just remember that when people go more quickly, it is a blessing to them because they don't suffer as much.  If they have done a good job with relationships, goodbyes are almost understood, because their outpouring of love speaks for itself.  Maybe the way you die is pre-ordained.  If you have damaged relationships, hopefully, you're granted the time to fix them.  I think about this a lot, because near the end of 2004, I was diagnosed with a very slow-moving type of leukemia.  No worries, doc gave me 5-10 years, and I have yet to need treatment.  I'm not saying this to start a pity party - I'm saying this because it is probably an indication that I have a LOT of work to do.  I've mostly recently reached out to a young man that loved me for 3 years - we broke up a month before my diagnosis.  I told him that I still love him and that I want him back.  He told me that his feelings have not diminished despite the 16 months we have been apart.  I can only hope.....

*Hugz* :'(

Do whatever you need to bring him back. Cybie is supporting you! 

Thank you, friend

 

[Cowboy Cody]

Froggie and cybernaut, I'm sitting here writing this in tears, because I can almost feel you both holding my hands.  I have terrible trouble being open about most everything - maybe that's why I feel so powerfully welded to Ennis - I SO understand him.  There is magic in this forum, ya know.   :'( :D

Honey, I'll hold your hand anytime you want...cry with you even. If posting here helps, then keep typing There are bits of Ennis and Jack in all of us, my guess is that it is why we are all so moved by BBM!
There is magic and love on this forum, and I'm so happy to have found it!

  Froggy

Can I propose a group hug? Magic exists right here on this board between all of us sharing a common bond of understanding each other's needs.

[cybernaut]

*Group hugz*!!!

[cybernaut]

she still feels like some things need to be cleared, but at least they have started the process.

Almost forgot about you froggy.
Sometimes anger can blind us so much, (I ain't a saint either), that we just couldn't see the road ahead.
But forgiveness blows away the fog along the journey. 

[*Froggy*]

she still feels like some things need to be cleared, but at least they have started the process.

Almost forgot about you froggy.
Sometimes anger can blind us so much, (I ain't a saint either), that we just couldn't see the road ahead.
But forgiveness blows away the fog along the journey. 

Moua x

[*Froggy*]

As suggested ..

Goup Hug!

[coguaro]

I participate me to!!

big kiss
coguaro

[*Froggy*]

...sorry for the *some might say* lame picture, but it was the only decent one I found on google!

[Cowboy Cody]

Frog - That ain't lame, the wisdom of Pooh is a great thing in life. I think we can all associate with the overall feelings of at least one of those characters. I'm man 'nuff to admit it. Me = Pooh

[*Froggy*]

Frog - That ain't lame, the wisdom of Pooh is a great thing in life. I think we can all associate with the overall feelings of at least one of those characters. I'm man 'nuff to admit it. Me = Pooh

 

[rane99]

Well, consarnit, break me off a piece of that group hug!!   

[JerBear418720]

On later viewings I don't lilke the way Ennis treats Alma.  I mean he has the odacity to say
"once burned" to her about the divorce when he said "if you don't want my kids I would
be happy to leave you alone" and all she said was she'd have them if they could be supported.
I mean she deserved to be loved, and at least I would hope he would understand that.

And even though we love this scene, and I hope I am not on sacred ground here, but kissing Jack right in eye shot of her like that was...well sort of a dig in a way. 

Luckily for Alma, she was perceptive and resourceful enough to save herself.  She was not getting much out of that marriage - no real financial support, no real love - so she did what she had to do.

In Ennis' defense, I think the message embedded in his not-very-kind words was:  "I did the best I could".  His best regarding Alma, of course, was not good enough - and she thought enough of herself not to settle for crumbs.  Also, Ennis did not understand that his relationship with Jack was a grievous insult to her femininity.

The whole situation, of course, was meant to illustrate the collateral damage of homophobia.  I came out (both to myself and the world) after being married for 10 years, and I can tell you from expereince that the pain impacts a lot of people - wives, inlaws, mutual friends, etc.  I believe that I handled my divorce with honor, but, even now 23 years after we spilt, we still find cordial contact impossible.

[JerBear418720]

Damn, I HAVE to stop pulling things out of the middle of threads - sorry, guys - but I missed that one, and I HAD to respond.  BBM keeps yanking so much stuff outta me.....

[Rod]

Apollonos:

My reference to JR Ewing was to only infer that all of the Texas scenes were very stereotypical of the 1970's Texas fervor that went on when JR/Dallas was the rave back then.  Big hair, big belt buckles, big belly, lavish cars, big money, on and on ....the scenes in BBM were fraught with this stereotypical Texas big, bold and brash theme...and that's not what Texas really is...I live in Texas and the film stretches this way out of proportion.  In no way was I trying to equate the evil, malevolent JR with any character...rather the shallow way they portrayed the Texas theme in the film.  That's all.

stationbbm-

Okay. I missed the fact that they carried the "over the top"  Texas look all the way through the movie. I wonder if they did that deliberately, for some reason, or if it was just an oversight.


I think that Annie et al. wanted to show the differences between Ennis' hard, ranch work life and Jack's more plush, "fancy" life.  I think it did look like Texas, (i have lived there) oddly before i came out I remember Urban Cowboy and all the "fancy" cowboys....makes me think of something i said years ago....I thought all cowboys were kinda gay...as in they love hats, love high heeled boots, loved their belt buckles, their fancy snap shirts etc...by the way I was being stereotypical because I said that to a "cowboy" friend who was particularly homophobic). for years after i left texas and new mexico (where i live on ranches/farms) i loved being "free" to wears addidas rather than cowboy boots, they were so much more comfortable!!

[Troy]

First time on this particular thread. Read something way back at beginning, someone said the scenes were too short. I agree. Sure the movie was 2 1/4 hours. But I've seen much longer and much slower moving movies, and BBM was so poetic, and had so much beautiful scenery it could've easily been longer. It covered 20 years and a lot of stuff. American movies tend to go way way too fast, something big always has to happen. This one was a bit slower, but not slow enough.

I would've liked to have seen much more drawn out scenes for the original summer on Brokeback mountain and more scenes too. The scenes were just a tad too choppy and short, like a music video. It was still highly effective and well done, but I dont think it would have hurt to include more, and it would have given us more to treasure and remember. The movie is almost like the short story, very bare bones and always having to fill in the blanks yourself.  This could be one reason it leaves such an impression, it keeps us wanting more more more.

To me it only seemed to drag for one brief instant, but that could have been just me, and adding more scenes, if they were chosen well, and paced well, wouldnt necessarily make it drag out more.

One example: the beautiful scene where Jack from atop his mountain post with the sheep looks way way down at the twinkle of firelight from Ennis' campfire in the pitch black valley at night, was way too short. I would have liked to have really felt his missing his buddy more, given me time to absorb the look on his face and really feel what he felt. The scene was incredibly brief.

[coguaro]

The scene I disike the most, not because it was a bad do or useless, is the Jack-Aguirre encounter. It represents a strong homophobia

[Patriot1]

The scene I can never watch and I close my eyes every time is when Ennis envisions how Jack died.  As far as I am concerned they could have left that out of the movie and I would have been just as happy.

[chameau]

The scene I can never watch and I close my eyes every time is when Ennis envisions how Jack died.  As far as I am concerned they could have left that out of the movie and I would have been just as happy.

They sticked to Annie's short story.  I close my eyes too.

[donnaread]

Hmm, I think the "yee-haw" in the scene where he went nuts pretending to be a rodeo cowboy fit - did you see his exaggerated expression (if only to get Ennis to laugh, aww )  I thought he was taking Ennis' comment about how his daddy thought "all rodeo cowboys was ****ups" and running with it, to show how ridiculous it was (remember his drawn-out line, with a purposeful drawl "waaavin' to the girls in the stands!" ?) and yes, to get Ennis to laugh. (which we see *how many times?*  oh yeah, just that once  )  and if it came across a little awkward, it was cause he wasn't from Texas, and I thought it seemed natural that it wasn't a perfect, authentic performance.

My least favorite scene, I would have to say, is when Jack's trying to make suggestions that might make Ennis happier and one of them is moving to a different state, "what about Texas?"  I always cringe when I hear that cause it's so blatant and so desperate and you feel so sorry for him, especially considering Ennis' somewhat callous reaction (yeah, I know they know how to push each other's buttons, but still...!)

I also don't like it when Ennis starts punching that guy in the truck who almost hits him after Alma has outed him at Thanksgiving.  I feel horrible for him and understand why he does it, but it makes me cringe, too, cause I don't want to see him beating up innocent people.  :-[

Personally, I LOVED the "YEE HAW!"  It shows so muich of Jack's nature, and besides it makes Ennis smile, and Ennis doesn't smile much.  I loved it when Ennis pushed him back and said "I'm tired of your dumb ass missing" Then Jack leans in to murmur something about "Lets get a move on before the Fish and Game catch us with an Elk"  I thought it was great because it was one of the times they showed them being happy together.

[The Ultimate Otaku]

As someone stated earlier, Jack's suggestion of "Why not Texas" is difficult to stomach because it's so desperate and sad, and you know that he knows Ennis won't like the idea. So I also dislike when he asks that. I LOVE BBM, but scenes I dislike, I'd have to say the Alma-and-Ennis sex scene, because I wonder how uncomfortable and awkward it must be for him...like what thoughts are going through his head? 
Also, I dislike Alma and Ennis' discussion in the "Condiments" (lol, "Ketchup!") section, because it is just sad to see that rift between Alma and Ennis growing. I mean, three cheers for Ennis and Jack, but I don't like the tenseness and conflict, the underlying anger and frustration, in that conversation btwn Ennis and Alma (the way Alma says she'll see if her sister can babysit the girls, and Ennis' insisting he has to work).

Ennis' insistence on work made me mad sometimes, too. I mean, I know, he's GOT to work, to survive and get money and feed his family. But the fact that his having to work stopped him from seeing Jack in August makes me mad everytime I see that part.