Author Topic: scenes of observation (Read 137351 times)

lightnin flat · « **Reply #30 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 08:21 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 01, 2007, 08:03 AM

You're most welcome, LF.

OT: More is better than less. Many things mentioned here are new to me...

I know how much you love jack/jake.

Did you notice in the confrontation scene when ennis went up to jack and pushed him jacks second to top shirt button was done up when the camera pulled away it was undone then when the camera went back to jack it was done up again .that just goes to prove who my eyes are on all the time.

tpe · « **Reply #31 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 08:26 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 01, 2007, 08:21 AM

I know how much you love jack/jake.

Did you notice in the confrontation scene when ennis went up to jack and pushed him jacks second to top shirt button was done up when the camera pulled away it was undone then when the camera went back to jack it was done up again .that just goes to prove who my eyes are on all the time.

Truthfully, I have not noticed this.

LF, perhaps one day, I can get to let you see this very shirt.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #32 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 08:33 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 01, 2007, 08:26 AM

Truthfully, I have not noticed this. LF, perhaps one day, I can get to let you see this very shirt.

That would be great as long as i could wear it for five minutes?

aintfoolin · « **Reply #33 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 04:03 PM »

Did anyone catch the way Jenny checked Jack out in the divorce scene? I think she was smitten! Alma Jr. just seemed very curious, but I feel Jenny had *other thoughts*.

:)Hmmm. Jack signaled his arrival by beeping his horn, they had to turn to see who it was and see the *almost kiss* Jack was gonna plant on Ennis.

Jack's jewelry in the reunion scene. Was Alma aware that Jack had money?I continue to be fascinated with the Jack/Alma dynamic. Ennis made it seem that Jack was just a fishin buddy who liked to get drunk and get wild, when she met Jack, her perception of him must have been a surprise. He was totally gorgeous which I feel contributed to her being so stunned. Probably pictured him quite differently.

Alma asks for smokes, but I never saw her take a drag off any cigarettes. btw, did anyone notice her slip showing in this scene? Great detail. Just a few thoughts and observations.

jackster · « **Reply #34 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 04:20 PM »

Quote from: aintfoolin on Oct 01, 2007, 04:03 PM

Did anyone catch the way Jenny checked Jack out in the divorce scene? I think she was smitten!

You Bet! She was thinking: "Come on, git in Jack', you can set next to me!" She wanted to get know Mr. Hottie. Junior maybe had heard stories from her mom and was a bit threatened by Jack's sudden appearance.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #35 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 04:24 PM »

   Aintfoolin i didnt notice alma,s slip but i did notice a hole in her tights when she was in the supermarket when ennis came to find her.
   Ennis did say jack wasnt the restaurant type we probaly just go out and get drunk so she probaly did have a very different perception of what he looked like.And yes he looked lovely.
   No i never saw alma smoke a cigarete.Didnt realy notice jenny either.

manhattangirl · « **Reply #36 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 06:31 PM »

Quote from: aintfoolin on Oct 01, 2007, 04:03 PM

Did anyone catch the way Jenny checked Jack out in the divorce scene? I think she was smitten! Alma Jr. just seemed very curious, but I feel Jenny had *other thoughts*. :)Hmmm. Jack signaled his arrival by beeping his horn, they had to turn to see who it was and see the *almost kiss* Jack was gonna plant on Ennis.

Jack's jewelry in the reunion scene. Was Alma aware that Jack had money?I continue to be fascinated with the Jack/Alma dynamic. Ennis made it seem that Jack was just a fishin buddy who liked to get drunk and get wild, when she met Jack, her perception of him must have been a surprise. He was totally gorgeous which I feel contributed to her being so stunned. Probably pictured him quite differently.

Alma asks for smokes, but I never saw her take a drag off any cigarettes. btw, did anyone notice her slip showing in this scene? Great detail. Just a few thoughts and observations.

I did notice her slip, and for some reason it touched me. I don't know, I guess it showed how this ordinary woman is being caught up in this ex-ordinary situation and the way she put her purse on her shoulder like a shield against this stranger at her door.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #37 on:** Oct 01, 2007, 06:50 PM »

I would just like to say thank you for all your posts

various mix of subjects very interesting .

tpe · « **Reply #38 on:** Oct 03, 2007, 08:41 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 01, 2007, 08:33 AM

That would be great as long as i could wear it for five minutes?

OT: others have, so why not?

lightnin flat · « **Reply #39 on:** Oct 03, 2007, 03:29 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 03, 2007, 08:41 AM

OT: others have, so why not?

hmm i would look forward to that.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #40 on:** Oct 04, 2007, 03:11 PM »

In the confrontation scene that word QUIT was said 3 times

when ennis said i just used to quit the job

when ennis said i cant quit this one and i cant get the time off either

And the final one from jack i wish i knew how to quit you. :\'(

jackster · « **Reply #41 on:** Oct 04, 2007, 04:14 PM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 04, 2007, 03:11 PM

In the confrontation scene that word QUIT was said 3 times

'Course don't forget the critical first use of the word . . . . remember?

"Quit your hammerin' and get over here!!"

lightnin flat · « **Reply #42 on:** Oct 05, 2007, 03:06 AM »

Quote from: jackster on Oct 04, 2007, 04:14 PM

'Course don't forget the critical first use of the word . . . . remember?

"Quit your hammerin' and get over here!!"

Thats right that was the first, out of the four times QUIT was said that was the best one because look what it lead to, the rest of the story.

lamusica · « **Reply #43 on:** Oct 05, 2007, 07:01 PM »

I don't think it is stretching it to say that QUIT, or rather, DON'T QUIT is a subtheme of the whole story. They could have quit after the time on BBM. They could have quit before or right after the reunion. They could have quit when both got married. Over the next twenty years, they could have quit at any time ----- but they didn't. Thus the subtitle: Love is a Force of Nature. Nothing can stand in the face of a natural disaster -- even love. The marriages faltered; the relationship between the two men continued on and on through good times and bad, until death did them part -- death is a force of nature. What a compelling story!

lightnin flat · « **Reply #44 on:** Oct 08, 2007, 04:01 PM »

The scene were jack says anything interesting up there in heaven.

I love the way jack and ennis have both got their hats on their knee,s

tpe · « **Reply #45 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:30 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 04, 2007, 03:11 PM

In the confrontation scene that word QUIT was said 3 times

when ennis said i just used to quit the job

when ennis said i cant quit this one and i cant get the time off either

And the final one from jack i wish i knew how to quit you. :\'(

Yes, I had wondered if this mirrored something about how the two of them were edging towards a break-up. With Ennis, I can't help but feel he was setting things up to be that way. With Jack, it was probably the final realization that things were not to change...

tpe · « **Reply #46 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:36 AM »

Quote from: lamusica on Oct 05, 2007, 07:01 PM

I don't think it is stretching it to say that QUIT, or rather, DON'T QUIT is a subtheme of the whole story. They could have quit after the time on BBM. They could have quit before or right after the reunion. They could have quit when both got married. Over the next twenty years, they could have quit at any time ----- but they didn't. Thus the subtitle: Love is a Force of Nature. Nothing can stand in the face of a natural disaster -- even love. The marriages faltered; the relationship between the two men continued on and on through good times and bad, until death did them part -- death is a force of nature. What a compelling story!

So true, lamusica. And somehow, we do get the feeling that quitting was not an option up until the very end, when the unthinkable became thinkable.

myprivatejack · « **Reply #47 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:39 AM »

Thomas,do you really mean that Ennis was "preparing" somehow the proper circumstances to force a break-up?Or,at least,to push Jack to take the initiative in breaking?

IMO,maybe he did without realizing it,but I never thought he did it on purpose. Doubtless,Jack was already at the point of breaking,not to stop loving Ennis,because he was fed up with so many years of having broken his dreams into pieces.But,I repite,Ennis was sure of being protecting,in his way,a never-ending relationship.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #48 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:40 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 09, 2007, 10:30 AM

Yes, I had wondered if this mirrored something about how the two of them were edging towards a break-up. With Ennis, I can't help but feel he was setting things up to be that way. With Jack, it was probably the final realization that things were not to change...

tpe, you could be right but i dont want to think of them breaking up but yes i think you are probaly right :\'(

tpe · « **Reply #49 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:47 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 09, 2007, 10:40 AM

tpe, you could be right but i dont want to think of them breaking up but yes i think you are probaly right :\'(

Same here LF. When I watched this scene in Maryland, I couldn't help thinking that they were groping towards some precipice -- almost willing it to happen. It was probably the furthest they pushed each other outside of their comforst zones. If there is any comfort in all this, we saw that in spite of all the heartache, both managed to back away from the precipice in this emotionally-chraged scene.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #50 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:52 AM »

   When ennis gets thrown from the horse and he runs after the mules he takes something from one of the packs that come of the mule and throws it does anyone know what it is is it a carton of cigarettes?

lightnin flat · « **Reply #51 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 10:57 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 09, 2007, 10:47 AM

Same here LF. When I watched this scene in Maryland, I couldn't help thinking that they were groping towards some precipice -- almost willing it to happen. It was probably the furthest they pushed each other outside of their comforst zones. If there is any comfort in all this, we saw that in spite of all the heartache, both managed to back away from the precipice in this emotionally-chraged scene.

Yes and as we know they had planned to meet up again thank god.

tpe · « **Reply #52 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 11:06 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 09, 2007, 10:57 AM

Yes and as we know they had planned to meet up again thank god.

But perhaps Jack would not have gone? I hate to think of what could have happened. In a sense, death proved merciful to their love.

lightnin flat · « **Reply #53 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 11:12 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 09, 2007, 11:06 AM

But perhaps Jack would not have gone? I hate to think of what could have happened. In a sense, death proved merciful to their love.

OH NO Jack would of gone i am sure of that i cant think any other way . :\'(

jessi · « **Reply #54 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 03:27 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 09, 2007, 11:06 AM

But perhaps Jack would not have gone? I hate to think of what could have happened. In a sense, death proved merciful to their love.

I don't think quitting was ever a true option for either of them, but I always have the words of the book in my head as well as what I heard them say. This force of nature was stronger than that, it would not allow the quitting. Jack would have been there in November, only one thing could stop him and my heart says it was far far from being an act of mercy, his death. He would have gone. There was still hope till he breathed till more.

tpe · « **Reply #55 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 03:50 PM »

Quote from: jessi on Oct 09, 2007, 03:27 PM

I don't think quitting was ever a true option for either of them, but I always have the words of the book in my head as well as what I heard them say. This force of nature was stronger than that, it would not allow the quitting. Jack would have been there in November, only one thing could stop him and my heart says it was far far from being an act of mercy, his death. He would have gone. There was still hope till he breathed till more.

Jack indeed might have been there, even if he would have moved with Randal to LF.

His death was certainly not an act of mercy. But I think it is possible that death would preserve the memory of things in their prime, as heroes of old sought an early death in exchange for remembrance.

jessi · « **Reply #56 on:** Oct 09, 2007, 04:14 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Oct 09, 2007, 03:50 PM

Jack indeed might have been there, even if he would have moved with Randal to LF.

His death was certainly not an act of mercy. But I think it is possible that death would preserve the memory of things in their prime, as heroes of old sought an early death in exchange for remembrance.

I can't imagine Jack really bringing anyone to his daddy's, maybe that was always dreaming. It's so important that annie let us know that never happened.

Do you mean for us, if we believe the affair was over from the movie, that it would have been better for us to remember them as being in the affair? I can't say since I don't believe the affair could have ever been over, but I would be interested to know if others might think that. I know it wasn't for Ennis, I mean knowing jack was dead. That man couldn't have been more destroyed, so sad it actually still makes my gut fist up.

jessi

lightnin flat · « **Reply #57 on:** Oct 10, 2007, 06:05 AM »

Quote from: jessi on Oct 09, 2007, 04:14 PM

I can't imagine Jack really bringing anyone to his daddy's, maybe that was always dreaming. It's so important that annie let us know that never happened.

Do you mean for us, if we believe the affair was over from the movie, that it would have been better for us to remember them as being in the affair? I can't say since I don't believe the affair could have ever been over, but I would be interested to know if others might think that. I know it wasn't for Ennis, I mean knowing jack was dead. That man couldn't have been more destroyed, so sad it actually still makes my gut fist up.

jessi

I hate the thought of jack taking randell up to L.F . I know in the confrontation scene it looked like things might be coming to a head with jack and ennis but i dont honestly believe for one minute jack would of quit no matter how bad things got he just could,nt do it.I know it looked like jack couldnt take anymore but to quit and never see ennis again no way.

tpe · « **Reply #58 on:** Oct 10, 2007, 07:09 AM »

Quote from: jessi on Oct 09, 2007, 04:14 PM

I can't imagine Jack really bringing anyone to his daddy's, maybe that was always dreaming. It's so important that annie let us know that never happened.

Do you mean for us, if we believe the affair was over from the movie, that it would have been better for us to remember them as being in the affair? I can't say since I don't believe the affair could have ever been over, but I would be interested to know if others might think that. I know it wasn't for Ennis, I mean knowing jack was dead. That man couldn't have been more destroyed, so sad it actually still makes my gut fist up.

jessi

Hello Jessi. I think it is better to refer to their love as being intact, even though they may have moved on. From the words of Jack's dad, Proulx implies that it was Jack's intention to move with Randall to LF. But yes, I don't think it ever became a reality, although the movie may have suggested more in some of the deleted scenes.

It can be argued that it was better for Jack to have died before he could have acted on his intention to move with Randall. Although you have said that you cannot imagine this to be so, the possibility is indeed there. What could have happened after that is hard to imagine. Ennis of course implied that he could "kill" Jack if he ever found out about things "he didn't know", but could he really have harmed Jack had he found out about Randall? And then again, would Jack have been content to lose Ennis and build a life with Randall?

All such possibilities, whether we believe it or not, become moot because of jack's death. The answer is: we will never know. In that sense, the memory of Jack is intact, even though it closed the door on Ennis forever.

tpe · « **Reply #59 on:** Oct 10, 2007, 07:12 AM »

Quote from: lightnin flat on Oct 10, 2007, 06:05 AM

I hate the thought of jack taking randell up to L.F . I know in the confrontation scene it looked like things might be coming to a head with jack and ennis but i dont honestly believe for one minute jack would of quit no matter how bad things got he just could,nt do it.I know it looked like jack couldnt take anymore but to quit and never see ennis again no way.

Hello LF. As I had said before, Jack moving on with Randall does not mean that the love is dead. This happens all the time in real life, when our relationships with our great loves become untenable, and we try to move on, but never forget. Such I believe is the case of Jack. I would tend to believe Gyllenhaal's opinion that he could have moved on, but I don't think it meant that the love was dead.

Author Topic: scenes of observation (Read 137351 times)

manhattangirl