Author Topic: When Did YOU first see the hint of feelings between them? (Read 21840 times)

forbiddenlovers · « **on:** Apr 11, 2006, 07:54 AM »

Ok, this is something I am sure has been touched on before, but there is so much to sort through, I haven't found it yet. So, here's my question.

When did YOU as the viewer first see the sign of something between them, before the FNIT scene. After watching this movie 4 times now in less than a week, it hit me last night that I would love to post that question.

For me, it was when Ennis ordered soup and the man said "I thought you didn't like soup" and Ennis said "Well, I'm sick of beans" And here's my rationale for that. Ennis never once complained about beans, Jack did. That morning Jack said "No more beans" Ennis told the man he orders food from that "he" was sick of beans, not Jack. It was almost as if this is the first moment I realize that Ennis is doing something for Jack, in terms of making sure he doesn't have beans anymore. Now, of course, we know, he has to eat them because of the bear spooking the mule and horses. But, still, that for me shows that Ennis was doing something for Jack and maybe then was touching on his feelings.

Now, there were sparks, I feel from the first meeting, but what I'm trying to say is when do you think that "spark" moved onto actual "feelings?"

Would LOVE to hear what others have to say about this!!

Ann

Kenny · « **Reply #1 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 08:03 AM »

Aww, I hadn't even noticed that!

I think this shot right here was the first time I really noticed Ennis's lingering looks towards Jack, and it got my blood to heating.

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #2 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 08:17 AM »

Oh yeah, definitely!! What scene is that? I mean, I know it's towards the beginning of their stint on BBM, but where is Jack in this scene so I know where this is?

tpe · « **Reply #3 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM »

Thanks forbiddenlovers.

The 'soup and beans' subject is indeed one of the primary topics in the thread entitled 'jack's stubbornness'. Do check it out as I am sure you will find it interesting.

You can certainly see interest on Jack's side in his first scene waiting for Aguirre to arrive. His direct and indirect looks (one via the mirror) indeed show that. Feelings? Perhaps not at this point.

When Aguirre was interrupted by a phone call, you see Ennis stealing a glance at the unsuspecting Jack and Jack then gazes longingly at an unsuspecting Ennis.

By the look in Jack's face, you can probably say that this may be the earliest instance when you detect some form of 'feeling' for Ennis, even though jack has not really gotten to know Ennis at that point.

Then you see the two scenes in the mountain: Jack looking down at night at Ennis's campfire; Ennis looking up at Jack while washing the coffee pot.

Then you have the 'soup and beans' sequence.

Then you get the conversation scene with 'Hell that's more words I've spoken in a year'. At this point, there is no doubt in your mind that there are feelings shared by the two for each other.

frances · « **Reply #4 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 08:40 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM

Then you see the two scenes in the mountain: Jack looking down at night at Ennis's campfire; Ennis looking up at Jack while washing the coffee pot.

These two scenes are my choice. Do I remember well? They are intentionally one after the other, aren' t they?

tpe · « **Reply #5 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 08:44 AM »

Quote from: frances on Apr 11, 2006, 08:40 AM

Quote from: tpe on Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM

Then you see the two scenes in the mountain: Jack looking down at night at Ennis's campfire; Ennis looking up at Jack while washing the coffee pot.

These two scenes are my choice. Do I remember well? They are intentionally one after the other, aren' t they?

Hi frances. There might be intervening scenes between the two, but you do get a strong sense that they belong together, or that they follow each other naturally.

I will have to agree with you that this is probably the earliest instance when you can see that BOTH of them are starting to develop feelings for each other.

keren_b · « **Reply #6 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:02 AM »

Quote from: tpe on Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM

Then you get the conversation scene with 'Hell that's more words I've spoken in a year'. At this point, there is no doubt in your mind that there are feelings shared by the two for each other.

I really love Jack's expression in this scene, you can see him breathing while Ennis is talking and he starts smiling softly to himself... when he looks up at Ennis, he looks in love. I can imagine his thought then: "OMG, he's finally opening up to me... and what a beautiful, sexy voice he has, I love listening to him... keep talking Ennis, just keep talking".

chameau · « **Reply #7 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:03 AM »

Quote from: frances on Apr 11, 2006, 08:40 AM

Quote from: tpe on Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM

Then you see the two scenes in the mountain: Jack looking down at night at Ennis's campfire; Ennis looking up at Jack while washing the coffee pot.

These two scenes are my choice. Do I remember well? They are intentionally one after the other, aren' t they?

Same here but Jack seems to show some interest at the very beginning, when he shaves and glances at Ennis through the mirror of his truck.

Valandil Eluch · « **Reply #8 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:19 AM »

it is true Jack was watching Ennis from the begining but it is on Brokeback where their feelings started flowing, i think that the most beautiful part are the beans he was indeed not doing for him but he was trying to be nice, the scene in which Jacks tries to cleans Ennis wounds is so beautiful the look on his face is fear and worry for the one he loves and Even Ennis perceives that and try to heal himselft. In ennis is wehn he tries to open and talk with jack they both look at each other with something in their eyes it is true jack had already fall in love with him and Ennis was in same process but that show us that Ennis was showing his vulnerable side to Jack.

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #9 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:33 AM »

Thank you for the index point of where to touch more on this topic. I have found this to be so interesting and so many different views on this, I love it.

I didn't think about that part, where Jacks looks down at camp and see Ennis's fire going. That's a beautiful, intent, wondering look on his face that makes you think there.

Also, when Ennis opens up and Jack remarks about how many words he just spoke, I LOVE the expressions of Ennis while he stares at Jack right before he says "hell, that's more words than I spoke all year" That is deep. Because, I think, he is opening up to Jack, because he's feeling a closeness and a comfort in Jack.

The scene where Jack tries to clean Ennis's wound is also powerful. Shows his caring nature, his wanting to nurture Ennis!!

And, I didn't notice the glances in Aguirre's offce for the first time. I need to watch that again tonight!!

I love everyone's input on this. Great topic of discussion. Off to check out the other thread that this is touched upon in.

Ann

tpe · « **Reply #10 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:42 AM »

Quote from: forbiddenlovers on Apr 11, 2006, 09:33 AM

The scene where Jack tries to clean Ennis's wound is also powerful. Shows his caring nature, his wanting to nurture Ennis!!

Ann

Indeed, Ann, this IS another powerful scene I completely forgot about. He used his own kerchief to do this. Now, perhaps this is usual among ranch hands (to use your kerchief as an all-purpose material), but it was shot so wonderfully that you could not miss Jack's caring nature expressed in this gesture.

Incidentally, one related scene that I have always watched very carefully is when Ennis arrives late at camp and Jack rises to face him with 'Where the hell have you been...'

In the screenplay, the directions explicitly call for Gyllenhaal/Jack to first show relief in his face that Ennis has arrived unharmed, AND THEN Gyllenhaal/Jack should quickly change to an attitude of irritation and anger -- to hide his immense relief that his Ennis was finally back.

I have been mixed as to whether Gyllenhaal followed this directive closely. He is sometimes too subtle for the camera (and for me, for that matter!)

We do see the look of concern in his face, though, when he comes back to camp and discovers Ennis missing. You see a look of worry and concern...

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #11 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 09:58 AM »

Ooh, I'm thinking of that scene now where Ennis arrives back at camp and Jack is furious. You're right, I don't think Jack showed the concern first, then follows up with the irriration. I often wonder about that, that human reaction that I think a lot of us do. We are concerned and so thankful that someone has come back, but ticked off that they were gone without us knowing what may have happened to them. Then we explode in anger. I equate it to when your child wanders off and you panic thinking she's been taken, and then you realize she's hiding in a rack of clothes. You're angry and you yell and you admonish your child, but honestly, you're so thankful and so relieved that nothing has happened. Your emotions get the best of you here. And I think that's maybe what Jack was going through at that moment. We see he isn't very mad once he realized what really happened, then we move onto Jack trying to fix Ennis's wound.

Allyce · « **Reply #12 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 10:34 AM »

For me, I think the first time Jack shows attraction to Ennis is at the very beginning, when he gets out of the truck and does all that leaning and staring, and when he's watching Ennis while shaving in the mirrior.

And this is the scene where I felt Ennis was begginning to be attracted to Jack...

Quote from: Kenny on Apr 11, 2006, 08:03 AM

Aww, I hadn't even noticed that!

I think this shot right here was the first time I really noticed Ennis's lingering looks towards Jack, and it got my blood to heating.

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #13 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 10:57 AM »

Ugh, I'm at work!! Where is Jack in this scene? I can't place this just from Ennis. What is goin on in this scene so I can figure it out? lol

chameau · « **Reply #14 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 02:10 PM »

Quote from: forbiddenlovers on Apr 11, 2006, 10:57 AM

Ugh, I'm at work!! Where is Jack in this scene? I can't place this just from Ennis. What is goin on in this scene so I can figure it out? lol

He looks at Jake leaving the camp on his horse going to the sheep. Nothing yet happened between them a this moment.

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #15 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 02:53 PM »

Thank you, now I know where that happens. Hmm, very interesting scene!!

Ann

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #16 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 02:54 PM »

That's where Jack is being bucked around by the horse I believe and Ennis watches him and Jack gets control and rides back to camp. I think, lol. Oh well, it's almost time to go home, so I'll check it out at home

Ann

Mars · « **Reply #17 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 03:17 PM »

Quote from: Carlos_H82 on Apr 11, 2006, 09:19 AM

it is true Jack was watching Ennis from the begining but it is on Brokeback where their feelings started flowing, i think that the most beautiful part are the beans he was indeed not doing for him but he was trying to be nice, the scene in which Jacks tries to cleans Ennis wounds is so beautiful the look on his face is fear and worry for the one he loves and Even Ennis perceives that and try to heal himselft. In ennis is wehn he tries to open and talk with jack they both look at each other with something in their eyes it is true jack had already fall in love with him and Ennis was in same process but that show us that Ennis was showing his vulnerable side to Jack.

I completely agree with you.

forbiddenlovers · « **Reply #18 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 03:23 PM »

Yeah, there was an attraction from Jack right from the start, but feelings didn't start to develop on either of their parts until BBM. Once they got to know each other, then I believe the true feelings started to come through!

Ann

jazzsinger · « **Reply #19 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 04:05 PM »

I think there are suggestions of Jack's attraction to Ennis from the beginning...as many of you have said. I don't think, with Ennis's suppressed sexuality, that he realises what he's feeling until the FNIT scene, and not even then! He's enjoying Jack's company, and there's even a suggestion he just might have some sexual feelings toward him (you might be a sinner, but I aint had the opportunity..)

He is shocked when Jack pulls his hand over in the tent, and reacts instinctively...he's quite drunk, not thinking about what he's doing. And even after this, he's still in denial about his feelings, until the second tent scene. But his feelings never ever mature and grow, they are always suppressed, a force of nature seething inside him, only bursting through when the force overpowers him.

LuvJackNasty · « **Reply #20 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 04:44 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Apr 11, 2006, 08:26 AM

Then you see the two scenes in the mountain: Jack looking down at night at Ennis's campfire; Ennis looking up at Jack while washing the coffee pot.

Then you have the 'soup and beans' sequence.

Then you get the conversation scene with 'Hell that's more words I've spoken in a year'. At this point, there is no doubt in your mind that there are feelings shared by the two for each other.

I would have to say the two scenes of them looking across the distance at each other was the first time I got the hint of feelings developing.

I love that scene when they are having the conversation and Ennis says "Hell that's more words than I've spoke in a year". The little grin on Jack's face at Ennis actually speaking and then Ennis just keeps on talking.

I also love when Jack is tending to Ennis' wound.

tpe · « **Reply #21 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 04:53 PM »

Quote from: LuvJackNasty on Apr 11, 2006, 04:44 PM

I would have to say the two scenes of them looking across the distance at each other was the first time I got the hint of feelings developing.

I love that scene when they are having the conversation and Ennis says "Hell that's more words than I've spoke in a year". The little grin on Jack's face at Ennis actually speaking and then Ennis just keeps on talking.

I also love when Jack is tending to Ennis' wound.

LuvJackNasty, did you also feel (as described in an old post I cannot remember exactly where) that after the "Hell that's more words than I've spoke in a year" scene, when Jack mimics a rodeo ride, that he was doing this out of affection for Ennis? It was as if he wanted to draw out more emotional reactions from Ennis -- in this case, a smile that makes the initial one look pale in comparison.

I did feel that he did this 'show' specifically for Ennis's benefit. And he did it out of affection, if he did not yet recognize love at this stage...

LuvJackNasty · « **Reply #22 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 05:37 PM »

Tpe,

Yes I did. Earlier scenes show Jack being "proud"- "I doubt there's a philly that can throw me" and the one time when he's leaving to go back to the sheep, he's having trouble controlling the horse and Ennis is watching. I think the rodeo mimic was him feeling comfortable enough to be "silly" in front of Ennis. I think he was so happy that Ennis was opening up that he did this to keep that mood going.

tpe · « **Reply #23 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 05:39 PM »

Quote from: LuvJackNasty on Apr 11, 2006, 05:37 PM

Tpe,

Yes I did. Earlier scenes show Jack being "proud"- "I doubt there's a philly that can throw me" and the one time when he's leaving to go back to the sheep, he's having trouble controlling the horse and Ennis is watching. I think the rodeo mimic was him feeling comfortable enough to be "silly" in front of Ennis. I think he was so happy that Ennis was opening up that he did this to keep that mood going.

Yes, I did feel that he was truly happy that he was connecting with Ennis. It was so childlike and so open-handed. It makes the heart ache.

LuvJackNasty · « **Reply #24 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 05:47 PM »

It was just a Jack thing to do. So free spirited. I also like the scene where Ennis shoots the elk for him/them. He did that for Jack and of course has to make the comment about how he was tired of Jack's dumbass missing. And then Jack makes the comment about not getting caught with the elk and Ennis kind of shoves him. That scene was on my mind ont he ride into work this morning. The playful nature they had with each other.

tpe · « **Reply #25 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 06:01 PM »

It is funny to see how Ennis always tries to cover-up his affection for Jack. He is seldom that successful in hiding it! And I think Jack always knew this too...

CherryCake · « **Reply #26 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 06:20 PM »

Those are all good scenes that show interest, mostly on Jack's part: Jack showing off on the horse for Ennis; Jack irritated after the bear scene; the 'No more beans scene; the shooting the elk all show thier interest. But what about this one guys ... After Jack started bitching about having to stay in the pup tent with the sheep and after they agree to trade places, Jack says as Ennis is leaving for the first night with the sheep: You won't get much sleep, I'll tell you that.'
The way that Jack tries to lock eyes with Ennis mounting the horse. , I get the sense that Jack REALLY doesnt want Ennis to leave because he is really horny. Notice the way Jack walks, and looks at Ennis with his bedroom eyes.
Remember, Jack's line right before this is: "I am pretty good with a can opener though (smirk)

What do you guys think about this scene?

tpe · « **Reply #27 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 06:34 PM »

Quote from: CherryCake on Apr 11, 2006, 06:20 PM

The way that Jack tries to lock eyes with Ennis mounting the horse. , I get the sense that Jack REALLY doesnt want Ennis to leave because he is really horny. Notice the way Jack walks, and looks at Ennis with his bedroom eyes.
Remember, Jack's line right right before this is "I am pretty good with a can opener thought (smirk)

These describe exactly my thoughts.

I had always suspected that Jack complaining about being the herder was just a ruse to get him and Ennis in Camp at the same time at night.

'That's not the point...', remember?

Quote

What do you guys think about this scene?

You can tell Jack wants him to stay. But he is touched that Ennis would take his place at so short notice...

filazahies · « **Reply #28 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 06:48 PM »

I haven't seen BBM for some time now. But I think I remember that Jack says, at least twice, that they should be together in the camp and sleep there. Am I right? If this is it, Jack shows his interest for being and sleeping with Jack almost since the beginning of theirstay at Brokeback.

tpe · « **Reply #29 on:** Apr 11, 2006, 07:06 PM »

Quote from: filazahies on Apr 11, 2006, 06:48 PM

I haven't seen BBM for some time now. But I think I remember that Jack says, at least twice, that they should be together in the camp and sleep there. Am I right? If this is it, Jack shows his interest for being and sleeping with Jack almost since the beginning of theirstay at Brokeback.

Yes filazahies, that is correct. I think he had it 'red-lined' all the way.