Topic: The neuances in the movie many might have over looked

[CherryCake]

Oh yes, I have a question, hope it's not OT and falls under one of the nuances of the film. I noticed that when Ennis comes back from getting thrown by the bear, he asked "Do you have whiskey or something?", as if he doesn't usually drink whiskey but needed something stronger. Of course throughout the rest of the movie Ennis seems to be drinking whiskey but only with Jack, rest of the time he's drinking beer. Why do you think that is? (Smiles asks herself, why do I care?) Was it just an economic thing?

Maybe the whiskey thing is something special which he only shared with Jack on those infrequent couplings.  :-[

I always assumed they drank whiskey on the mountain because they didn't have any way to keep beer cold for a week, beer took up too much space on the mule and whiskey neither took up a lot of space nor need ed to be refrigerated.

They had a way to keep beer cold, in a wet sack in the river.  Thats how you do it when you go camping. It's even metioned in the SS.
But whiskey warms up the cold mountain night and yes, easier to carry, so make sense to have the whiskey around.
O' course, would come in awful handy if someone had a mind to get someone liquored up, heheh

Yes, I did read in the story about the wet sack. I just never felt it kept the beer cold enough.  But I think it was more of a transport thing. And a pint of whiskey does get you drunker faster if you have something in mind, like you say.   

True...

well, one thing we all agree on... Jack sure didn't mind keeping Ennis full o' whisky. hehe

[MississaugaRed]

After 27 times, still things leaping to mind that hadn't been so clear the first 26 ...   

FNIT - when J & E are kneeling up facing each other, grabbing shoulders, forehead to forehead (the most intense part of this whole scene imo) it first appears as though Ennis was trying to keep Jack slightly away from him, and fighting his own self in the bargain ... but there is one point where his hand goes up to hold the side of Jack's head ... and it doesn't look so much like he's fighting, anymore ...  I love it because it's a gesture they both share with each other over the years they're together ... *sigh*


Mailing postcard to Jack ... when Ennis comes out of the post office after mailing "you bet", looks for a second like he's fiddling with this wedding right ... already feeling guilty, or trapped??

Reunion kiss ... Again with hands holding each others heads ... and you get a glimpse of Jack's ornate, obviously expensive wedding ring, then from the other side a glimpse of Ennis's plain gold wedding band.  A sign of their different financial and social circumstances.

Motel scene ... after Jack asks "what are we goin' to do now?", watching Ennis's face it struck me that he really takes his time replying ... and it looks like he's trying not to cry.  There is a glint in his eyes between each sentence he manages to force out, like he's steeling himself to say words that are tearing him apart to speak.  I had never really, REALLY paid attention before to how very badly saying "doubt there's nothin' we can do" hurt Ennis - always just thought about what it had been doing to Jack .... I don't think Ennis was as stoic about this declaration as I had thought in the past.


No doubt most of these things have been talked about in specific discussion threads in great detail, but I sure like this having a place to come just to speak in general on small things that stand out for us each viewing.  Great idea for a place to share the little (but important!) things! 

[gimmejack]

I never noticed the fiddling of the wedding rings and the difference in their wedding bands is an interesting observation, showing the skills and detail of the production.  Thanks for that, time to go watch again now!

[LuvJackNasty]

I never noticed him fiddling around with his wedding ring before. I'll have to look on my next viewing. 

[NoReins]

Motel scene ... after Jack asks "what are we goin' to do now?", watching Ennis's face it struck me that he really takes his time replying ... and it looks like he's trying not to cry.  There is a glint in his eyes between each sentence he manages to force out, like he's steeling himself to say words that are tearing him apart to speak.  I had never really, REALLY paid attention before to how very badly saying "doubt there's nothin' we can do" hurt Ennis - always just thought about what it had been doing to Jack .... I don't think Ennis was as stoic about this declaration as I had thought in the past.

Yeah, that's what gets me most about that scene - it's tearing him apart that he has to shoot Jack's airplane out of the sky (thanks Annie ) I spotted that on my second viewing and it breaks my heart. The change in his expression between "me? ahdunno" and "I doubt there's nothin' we can do" gives away his true feelings. I just wish Jack had been able to see his face there :\'(

[MississaugaRed]

Yeah, that's what gets me most about that scene - it's tearing him apart that he has to shoot Jack's airplane out of the sky (thanks Annie ) I spotted that on my second viewing and it breaks my heart. The change in his expression between "me? ahdunno" and "I doubt there's nothin' we can do" gives away his true feelings. I just wish Jack had been able to see his face there    

Ain't that the truth!  I'm glad Jack was at least able to see his face during the "prayer of thanks" scene ... or maybe we should call it "shooting Jack's airplane out of the sky, Part 2".

Because I'm sooo Jack-centric, I've often missed Ennis's reactions the first 20 or so times around.    These days I will sometime replay a scene, first to keep my eyes riveted on Jack's face, the next time on Ennis's.  Of course, my eyes still slip back to Jack, so then I have to start all over again ... you get the picture!      Does help you notice those little nuances ...

Can you actually wear out just parts of a DVD, I wonder?    If so, those tent scenes and the reunion kiss will soon be obliterated from the copy I'm currently playing! 

[NoReins]

Because I'm sooo Jack-centric, I've often missed Ennis's reactions the first 20 or so times around.    These days I will sometime replay a scene, first to keep my eyes riveted on Jack's face, the next time on Ennis's.  Of course, my eyes still slip back to Jack, so then I have to start all over again ... you get the picture!      Does help you notice those little nuances ...

You know, I'm starting to think that we should arrange a BBM viewing somewhere between Canada and Scotland (not in the middle of the Atlantic, obviously ) because between us we might actually see the whole movie. I keep trying to watch Jack more closely, but my eyes wander back to Ennis and I'm lost all over again

[MississaugaRed]

Because I'm sooo Jack-centric, I've often missed Ennis's reactions the first 20 or so times around.    These days I will sometime replay a scene, first to keep my eyes riveted on Jack's face, the next time on Ennis's.  Of course, my eyes still slip back to Jack, so then I have to start all over again ... you get the picture!      Does help you notice those little nuances ...

You know, I'm starting to think that we should arrange a BBM viewing somewhere between Canada and Scotland (not in the middle of the Atlantic, obviously ) because between us we might actually see the whole movie. I keep trying to watch Jack more closely, but my eyes wander back to Ennis and I'm lost all over again

So, when I've wrecked all the Jack shots, I'll send you what's left of the DVD 'cause it'll be all Ennis, and you can do the same with the DVD you burn out alll the Ennis images on.  Recycle, reuse ...   

Maybe we should make the meeting on a cruise ship in the middle of the Atlantic?? 

BTW ... since reading all the fanfic, I've really started noticing how great both guys look on a horse!     Here is one area where Ennis's experience does shine through ... 

[welshwitch]

And in jeans - I'm not, or wasn't, a great fan till I saw these two in them ( and Aguirre, who looked like crap!).

Maybe it's an  American thing - American men look great in the jeans/check short/n=boots/hat combo but Brits just look stupid.

Somehow all the clothes in here look just right, Jack's dirty worn boots, eg.

[NoReins]

Because I'm sooo Jack-centric, I've often missed Ennis's reactions the first 20 or so times around.    These days I will sometime replay a scene, first to keep my eyes riveted on Jack's face, the next time on Ennis's.  Of course, my eyes still slip back to Jack, so then I have to start all over again ... you get the picture!      Does help you notice those little nuances ...

You know, I'm starting to think that we should arrange a BBM viewing somewhere between Canada and Scotland (not in the middle of the Atlantic, obviously ) because between us we might actually see the whole movie. I keep trying to watch Jack more closely, but my eyes wander back to Ennis and I'm lost all over again

So, when I've wrecked all the Jack shots, I'll send you what's left of the DVD 'cause it'll be all Ennis, and you can do the same with the DVD you burn out alll the Ennis images on.  Recycle, reuse ...   

Maybe we should make the meeting on a cruise ship in the middle of the Atlantic?? 

BTW ... since reading all the fanfic, I've really started noticing how great both guys look on a horse!     Here is one area where Ennis's experience does shine through ... 

Ha! That sounds like a plan

I know what you mean about the horse thing - originally it was just like "oh yeah, they're on horseback" but now since so many of the fanfics comment on how each of them appreciated how the other looked on a horse I'm really appreciating it myself

[MississaugaRed]

Maybe we should make the meeting on a cruise ship in the middle of the Atlantic?? 

BTW ... since reading all the fanfic, I've really started noticing how great both guys look on a horse!     Here is one area where Ennis's experience does shine through ... 

Ha! That sounds like a plan

I know what you mean about the horse thing - originally it was just like "oh yeah, they're on horseback" but now since so many of the fanfics comment on how each of them appreciated how the other looked on a horse I'm really appreciating it myself

      Yep, when I see the horseback riding scenes .. I get "nuances of appreciation" all over the place.   

Also ... love that little look Ennis shoots Jack morning after FNIT, when he mounts his horse, just before galloping away ... must have be difficult for him to even look at Jack that first moment ...   :-[ 

[CherryCake]

Maybe we should make the meeting on a cruise ship in the middle of the Atlantic?? 

BTW ... since reading all the fanfic, I've really started noticing how great both guys look on a horse!     Here is one area where Ennis's experience does shine through ... 

Ha! That sounds like a plan

I know what you mean about the horse thing - originally it was just like "oh yeah, they're on horseback" but now since so many of the fanfics comment on how each of them appreciated how the other looked on a horse I'm really appreciating it myself

      Yep, when I see the horseback riding scenes .. I get "nuances of appreciation" all over the place.   

Also ... love that little look Ennis shoots Jack morning after FNIT, when he mounts his horse, just before galloping away ... must have be difficult for him to even look at Jack that first moment ...   :-[ 

What about the fact that Jack even got up to see his lover off.  And it looked like he was walking stiffly.  :`) :`)

[welshwitch]

And the ? hurt/baffled/worried look on Jack's face? He must have been on tenterhooks for the rest of the day till he went up to try and talk to Ennis - and that took some guts too.

[MississaugaRed]

And the ? hurt/baffled/worried look on Jack's face? He must have been on tenterhooks for the rest of the day till he went up to try and talk to Ennis - and that took some guts too.

and that little look Jack shots to Ennis and the little sigh, just before Ennis sits for the "One shot thing" conversation ...  One of the sweetest scenes all of BBM-dom.

[CherryCake]

And the ? hurt/baffled/worried look on Jack's face? He must have been on tenterhooks for the rest of the day till he went up to try and talk to Ennis - and that took some guts too.

YES!  This is one of my fav of Jack's expression.  He got the hot lovin' he was after the night before, and now to deal with the day after without the drunken heat of passion.  He did have all day to wonder what Ennis would do.  He didn't know if he was gonna be just a piece of one-night a** or if Ennis was gonna ignore him the rest of thier days on Brokeback.  That mornin' after look broke my heart.

[NoReins]

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

(OT - see, MissRed? I'm trying to watch Jack more closely )

[MississaugaRed]

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

(OT - see, MissRed? I'm trying to watch Jack more closely )

Your efforts are appreciated, NoReins!   

Although I'm sure it helps when the scenes don't actually have Ennis IN them ...   

I like what you're saying about that moment of Jack's too, smoking alone in the twilight, lookng back at the fire marking the main camp.  Maybe he was missing the company as much as the extra comforts ... yes, I sure do like the direction you're goin' ...   

[NoReins]

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

(OT - see, MissRed? I'm trying to watch Jack more closely )

Your efforts are appreciated, NoReins!   

Although I'm sure it helps when the scenes don't actually have Ennis IN them ...   

I like what you're saying about that moment of Jack's too, smoking alone in the twilight, lookng back at the fire marking the main camp.  Maybe he was missing the company as much as the extra comforts ... yes, I sure do like the direction you're goin' ...   

Damn - you picked up on that

[smilesalot]

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

In the ss it's clear that Jack looks over at the firelight and wonders about Ennis and what's he's doing. Just can't keep his eyes from wandering over there...it shows he's fascinated by Ennis and he's in his thoughts.

During the day Ennis looked across a great gulf and sometimes saw Jack, a small dot moving across a high meadow, as an insect moves across a tablecloth; Jack, in his dark camp, saw Ennis as night fire, a red spark on the huge black mass of mountain.

Jack's expression, though, when he looks at that nightfire is precious. It's just so amazing how much both Jake and Heath convey with just a glance. (or a grunt ...or a groan.... )

[MississaugaRed]

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

(OT - see, MissRed? I'm trying to watch Jack more closely )

Your efforts are appreciated, NoReins!   

Although I'm sure it helps when the scenes don't actually have Ennis IN them ...   

I like what you're saying about that moment of Jack's too, smoking alone in the twilight, lookng back at the fire marking the main camp.  Maybe he was missing the company as much as the extra comforts ... yes, I sure do like the direction you're goin' ...   

Damn - you picked up on that

yup ... we are soooo two sides of the same coin  ...    

Spotted something last night that I'd never noticed before. When Jack is sitting up on the mountain with the sheep (first night up there?) and he looks down at the firelight from Ennis's camp he sighs deeply. Now, maybe this is just because he's thinking he shouldn't have to be away from the main camp....but maybe there's more to it?

In the ss it's clear that Jack looks over at the firelight and wonders about Ennis and what's he's doing. Just can't keep his eyes from wandering over there...it shows he's fascinated by Ennis and he's in his thoughts.

During the day Ennis looked across a great gulf and sometimes saw Jack, a small dot moving across a high meadow, as an insect moves across a tablecloth; Jack, in his dark camp, saw Ennis as night fire, a red spark on the huge black mass of mountain.

Jack's expression, though, when he looks at that nightfire is precious. It's just so amazing how much both Jake and Heath convey with just a glance. (or a grunt ...or a groan.... )

We all appreciate their non-verbal communication as much as anything they speak, you bet.    Although, that hasn't stopped us from speculatiing on what Jack MIGHT have been saying FNIT during the ... ahhhhh ... non-verbal communication ( :-[ ) ....  shall we say!?!  Speaking of fine nuances ... those nuances were mighty fine then, yessir ... 

[welshwitch]

I've just watched our beautiful movie again and noticed a little detail I hadn't registered before When Jack drives into sight for the first time, his truck comes out of a cloud of dust. Then when Ennis drives away after their last scene together, he drives off with a similar cloud of dist behind him. Kind of rounds the two scenes off and connects them - then of course there's all the resonances of "dust".