« previous next »
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 8   Go Down

Author Topic: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet  (Read 97037 times)

Offline MississaugaRed

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 3641
  • Gender: Female
  • Gone too soon, but never forgotten.
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #150 on: Jul 24, 2006, 02:28 PM »
Quote from: aimi15 on Jul 24, 2006, 01:24 PM
MisRed, this is one of the most tearjerking but utterly beautiful posts i have read. It hadn't really occurred to me in that way before, i'm usually in a mess by then, but the way you have put it makes total sense. Thank you for a truly gorgeous post. ^f^
thanks, aimi15!  ^f^ But it's because of eveyone else here at ej that these things come to mind ...  :^^) 
Reading what everyone else writes here gives me new perspectives and insights, makes it seem like I'm watching BBM with fresh eyes each time ... something you couldn't nornally say about something you've seen 27 times!  ::)

Quote from: browneyes on Jul 24, 2006, 01:27 PM
And to me the shirts prove that Jack would've still saw Ennis, even if he tried to have a life with someone else. The shirts to me is like an unconditional love Jack had for Ennis and no one could change that. In the scene, after the flashback and the look on Jack's face, to me Jack is thinking that his dream with Ennis is dead. So he can try to find someone to share his sweet life. But the shirts prove Jack would've still saw Ennis even after trying to have a life with someone else. That is why I believe the November trip would've been the big ultimatum-the decision that would change the course of their entire relationship. If Ennis knew Jack was having a life w/ someone else, he would've been on fire. However, what Ennis would've done is totally left in the air. He probably would've killed Randall in his sleep. And have that life with Jack.    
Interesting point, browneyes, about Ennis being "on fire", and an apt choice of words, I think.   :)   For all that he's often spoken of as being the quiet one, his intensity does burn through, particularly in anything to do with his relationship with our Jack. 

Just the way that he switches the shirts around so that his own is now covering Jack's, speaks to the protective instincts he has always had inside, trying to keep Jack safe.  Ultimately he had been unable to shield Jack from being hurt by the world - and indeed Ennis had a hand in the hurting, mortal blows aside.  Sometimes I see this reversal of the shirts as being an apology to Jack for that hurt he suffered due to Ennis's fears, as well as a promise that Ennis's love would have been there for him always, regardless of those last words spoken.

Don't know that I think Ennis would go as far as to kill Randall in his sleep, though ...  Now, in a bar fight maybe ...  ;)   
Like you, many of us want to believe that Ennis would one day have decided to have that sweet life with Jack ... and we can speculate on what might have one day made him change is mind .... left up in the air, as you say, because of Jack's life being cut short.
Logged
"Tha mo bhàta-foluaimein loma-làn easgannan".
My hovercraft is full of eels.

“I miss you,” Jack whispered. “I miss you.” He felt loved. He felt heard. Shades of Grey by MidwestGirl

Offline gimmejack

  • Alma
  • ****
  • Posts: 331
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #151 on: Jul 24, 2006, 02:39 PM »
Quote from: browneyes on Jul 24, 2006, 01:27 PM
And to me the shirts prove that Jack would've still saw Ennis, even if he tried to have a life with someone else. The shirts to me is like an unconditional love Jack had for Ennis and no one could change that. In the scene, after the flashback and the look on Jack's face, to me Jack is thinking that his dream with Ennis is dead. So he can try to find someone to share his sweet life. But the shirts prove Jack would've still saw Ennis even after trying to have a life with someone else. That is why I believe the November trip would've been the big ultimatum-the decision that would change the course of their entire relationship. If Ennis knew Jack was having a life w/ someone else, he would've been on fire. However, what Ennis would've done is totally left in the air. He probably would've killed Randall in his sleep. And have that life with Jack.    
I do also believe that November would have been ultimatum month...Ennis let so much come to the surface at the final meeting and once you get that all out and show yourself like that...it is a huge relief.  I truly feel those 2 had nowhere to go but up after that last meeting especially with Ennis initiating their next meeting so sweetly. 

Your point of the post is what makes the story all the more tragic    :\'(
Logged
"Who would give a law to lovers? Love is unto itself a higher law."
~Boethius~

browneyes

  • Guest
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #152 on: Jul 24, 2006, 02:41 PM »
Just like the tagline "Love is a Force of Nature". They couldn't help loving each other, they could have other lives other relationships but ultimately they were in love with each other and couldn't do anything about it. 
Logged

Offline gimmejack

  • Alma
  • ****
  • Posts: 331
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #153 on: Jul 24, 2006, 02:43 PM »
So true, they did what they could.  Their time was precious... If it wasn't there is no way Jack would have kept making those 14 hour trips.  And Ennis giving up his jobs.
Logged
"Who would give a law to lovers? Love is unto itself a higher law."
~Boethius~

Offline LuvJackNasty

  • Mod-ChickY Brigade
  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 26177
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #154 on: Jul 24, 2006, 08:42 PM »
Quote from: MississaugaRed on Jul 24, 2006, 02:28 PM

Quote from: browneyes on Jul 24, 2006, 01:27 PM
And to me the shirts prove that Jack would've still saw Ennis, even if he tried to have a life with someone else. The shirts to me is like an unconditional love Jack had for Ennis and no one could change that. In the scene, after the flashback and the look on Jack's face, to me Jack is thinking that his dream with Ennis is dead. So he can try to find someone to share his sweet life. But the shirts prove Jack would've still saw Ennis even after trying to have a life with someone else. That is why I believe the November trip would've been the big ultimatum-the decision that would change the course of their entire relationship. If Ennis knew Jack was having a life w/ someone else, he would've been on fire. However, what Ennis would've done is totally left in the air. He probably would've killed Randall in his sleep. And have that life with Jack.    
Interesting point, browneyes, about Ennis being "on fire", and an apt choice of words, I think.   :)   For all that he's often spoken of as being the quiet one, his intensity does burn through, particularly in anything to do with his relationship with our Jack. 

Just the way that he switches the shirts around so that his own is now covering Jack's, speaks to the protective instincts he has always had inside, trying to keep Jack safe.   Ultimately he had been unable to shield Jack from being hurt by the world - and indeed Ennis had a hand in the hurting, mortal blows aside.  Sometimes I see this reversal of the shirts as being an apology to Jack for that hurt he suffered due to Ennis's fears, as well as a promise that Ennis's love would have been there for him always, regardless of those last words spoken.
Don't know that I think Ennis would go as far as to kill Randall in his sleep, though ...  Now, in a bar fight maybe ...  ;)   
Like you, many of us want to believe that Ennis would one day have decided to have that sweet life with Jack ... and we can speculate on what might have one day made him change is mind .... left up in the air, as you say, because of Jack's life being cut short.

Great posts browneyes and Miss-Red.  :\'( Ennis' fear was getting the tire iron- I think by finding those shirts he realized there is a fate worse than death.  :(
Logged
“What Jack remembered and craved in a way he could neither help nor understand was the time that distant summer on Brokeback when Ennis had come up behind him and pulled him close, the silent embrace satisfying some shared and sexless hunger."

You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope someday you'll join us And the world will live as one ~ Imagine- J. Lennon

browneyes

  • Guest
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #155 on: Jul 25, 2006, 06:13 AM »
And what really breaks my heart is that it's possible Jack died thinking Ennis didn't want to see him again "why don't you just let me be". Can u just imagine how overjoyed Jack would've been to realize Ennis didn't mean that and still wanted to meet in November? The circumstances of Jack's dead is just really tragic. He didn't get to have that sweet life with Ennis. I still think bringing up Randall would've been a way to prove to Ennis he's really serious about moving on. And Ennis didn't know how Jack really felt about him until he found the shirts.
Logged

Offline jeffjoe

  • My name is Joe... Jeff Joe
  • Ennis
  • ******
  • Posts: 1756
  • Gender: Male
  • The magic is in us here...
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #156 on: Jul 25, 2006, 10:48 PM »
Quote from: browneyes on Jul 25, 2006, 06:13 AM
And what really breaks my heart is that it's possible Jack died thinking Ennis didn't want to see him again "why don't you just let me be". Can u just imagine how overjoyed Jack would've been to realize Ennis didn't mean that and still wanted to meet in November? The circumstances of Jack's dead is just really tragic. He didn't get to have that sweet life with Ennis. I still think bringing up Randall would've been a way to prove to Ennis he's really serious about moving on. And Ennis didn't know how Jack really felt about him until he found the shirts.
It's so sad the Jack dead without Ennis near him and it's worst believe maybe Jack thinking Ennis leave him forever in his last moment, Whem he found the shirts, it's like Jack sould is telling..."Ennis my love, I was so afraid than you will never come back to me, but now you are to my side... I'm still here with you always...Jack i swear..."   
Logged
Nunca me alejo, mas allá de una mirada...

Offline welshwitch

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 6480
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #157 on: Jul 26, 2006, 09:24 AM »
There's a way of seeing the shirts as Jack's "message in a bottle" to Ennis. He could hardly leave him a letter ( in the careof Lureen or his parents?) but the shirts look on the surface just like two shirts, even if theone inside had been discovered. The only person they have significance for is Enns.I wonder if Jack had a presentimetn or idea that he might die young/be kiiled?
Logged

Offline keren_b

  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 23651
  • Country: il
  • Gender: Female
  • There will never be another Heath
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #158 on: Jul 26, 2006, 09:34 AM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 26, 2006, 09:24 AM
There's a way of seeing the shirts as Jack's "message in a bottle" to Ennis. He could hardly leave him a letter ( in the careof Lureen or his parents?) but the shirts look on the surface just like two shirts, even if theone inside had been discovered. The only person they have significance for is Enns.I wonder if Jack had a presentimetn or idea that he might die young/be kiiled?

I've never thought about it... but I don't think that was on Jack's mind, or that he expected Ennis to find the shirts. I always thought he kept them together like that because he wanted to remember the way they were together that summer on brokeback, and he put Ennis's shirt inside of his because he felt that Ennis was an inseperable part of him, inside him, like the story says - like two skins, one inside the other, two in one. he arranged the shirts the way he wanted him and Ennis to be in real life - one inside the other, two in one.
Logged
The truth is... sometimes I miss you so much I can hardly stand it.

Offline NoReins

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 7677
  • Gender: Female
  • Redlined it all the way
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #159 on: Jul 26, 2006, 10:45 AM »
Quote from: keren_b on Jul 26, 2006, 09:34 AM
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 26, 2006, 09:24 AM
There's a way of seeing the shirts as Jack's "message in a bottle" to Ennis. He could hardly leave him a letter ( in the careof Lureen or his parents?) but the shirts look on the surface just like two shirts, even if theone inside had been discovered. The only person they have significance for is Enns.I wonder if Jack had a presentimetn or idea that he might die young/be kiiled?

I've never thought about it... but I don't think that was on Jack's mind, or that he expected Ennis to find the shirts. I always thought he kept them together like that because he wanted to remember the way they were together that summer on brokeback, and he put Ennis's shirt inside of his because he felt that Ennis was an inseperable part of him, inside him, like the story says - like two skins, one inside the other, two in one. he arranged the shirts the way he wanted him and Ennis to be in real life - one inside the other, two in one.

Yeah, that's my take on it too Keren - beautifully put ^f^
Logged
He will be eternally missed, but he will never be forgotten

Christopher Nolan, accepting the Best Supporting Actor Golden Globe on Heath's behalf.

He was, as an actor and a professional and a human being, one of a kind

Charles Roven, accepting Heath's BAFTA.

This award tonight would have humbly validated Heath's quiet determination to be truly accepted by you all here — his peers within an industry he so loved.

Kim Ledger, accepting Heath's Oscar.

Offline welshwitch

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 6480
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #160 on: Jul 26, 2006, 10:48 AM »
Of course you're right but there's more than one way of looking at things. What kind of surprises me is the way the shirts are left - not put away as ( in the movie) Ennis does but not very well hidden - even a casual look in the closet is enough for Ennis to find them. Of course Jack assumed he'd be back himself and the shirts would be safe enough where they were.

I also see them as his ideal vision of what he wanted the realtionship to be, not what it was. They were emotionally inseparable perhaps, but not physically so or in Jack's case sexually either. If anything the shirts were a reminder of that Brokeback summer, yet they also demonstrate how it ended.
Logged

Offline MississaugaRed

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 3641
  • Gender: Female
  • Gone too soon, but never forgotten.
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #161 on: Jul 26, 2006, 10:59 AM »
Aside from the postcards (and we're not sure if either man kept those) the shirts are the only token either ever had from the other (that we know of).  It's not surprising to me that Jack would have kept them all those years. He was the romantic.  Ennis was always a part of him from those days on Brokeback, even while he was doing those things Ennis would have killed him for had he come to know them.  As you say ... inseparable, be it in love or in hurt.
Logged
"Tha mo bhàta-foluaimein loma-làn easgannan".
My hovercraft is full of eels.

“I miss you,” Jack whispered. “I miss you.” He felt loved. He felt heard. Shades of Grey by MidwestGirl

Offline NoReins

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 7677
  • Gender: Female
  • Redlined it all the way
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #162 on: Jul 26, 2006, 11:07 AM »
That's an interesting question about the postcards MissRed. The hopeless romantic in me says that they would both have kept the cards, hidden away somewhere safe. This seems to be the view that most fanfic writers have too - I've read bits about Jack finding the postcards that Ennis kept in quite a few fics (sorry, I know that's *o))

I actually just realised something: when Ennis goes to send the "you bet" postcard to Jack, he has Jack's address written on a scrap of paper but Jack wrote his address on the postcard so Ennis could have just taken that with him to the post office. Did he leave it behind because he didn't want anyone to see the card and think there was anything odd about it? Or did he leave it behind in order to avoid it getting damaged in any way, because it meant too much to him?

Ahdunno :s)
Logged
He will be eternally missed, but he will never be forgotten

Christopher Nolan, accepting the Best Supporting Actor Golden Globe on Heath's behalf.

He was, as an actor and a professional and a human being, one of a kind

Charles Roven, accepting Heath's BAFTA.

This award tonight would have humbly validated Heath's quiet determination to be truly accepted by you all here — his peers within an industry he so loved.

Kim Ledger, accepting Heath's Oscar.

Offline MississaugaRed

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 3641
  • Gender: Female
  • Gone too soon, but never forgotten.
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #163 on: Jul 26, 2006, 12:18 PM »
Quote from: NoReins on Jul 26, 2006, 11:07 AM
That's an interesting question about the postcards MissRed. The hopeless romantic in me says that they would both have kept the cards, hidden away somewhere safe. This seems to be the view that most fanfic writers have too - I've read bits about Jack finding the postcards that Ennis kept in quite a few fics (sorry, I know that's *o))

I actually just realised something: when Ennis goes to send the "you bet" postcard to Jack, he has Jack's address written on a scrap of paper but Jack wrote his address on the postcard so Ennis could have just taken that with him to the post office. Did he leave it behind because he didn't want anyone to see the card and think there was anything odd about it? Or did he leave it behind in order to avoid it getting damaged in any way, because it meant too much to him?

Ahdunno :s)

as you say ... ahdunno, either ...  :s)  pieces of the puzzel we can fill in to best suit our own wishes, I guess - and I'm with you on the romantic part, being hopeful they were kept ...

The shirts have become everything to us, just as they became everything to Ennis, because they are the one token we do KNOW.   <^(

Now I'm starting to prefer thinking of the shirts has being protected in that part of Jack's closet rather than hidden.  Hidden would imply to me that maybe they were never meant to be found.  Where they had rested all that time says to me they were being shielded from careless eyes, but were not meant to be so concealed that they couldn't be claimed when the right person, the one worthy, came seeking  ...
Logged
"Tha mo bhàta-foluaimein loma-làn easgannan".
My hovercraft is full of eels.

“I miss you,” Jack whispered. “I miss you.” He felt loved. He felt heard. Shades of Grey by MidwestGirl

Offline welshwitch

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 6480
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #164 on: Jul 26, 2006, 02:43 PM »
So Ennis becomes the knight, the one worthy to find the grail, and the shirts become the chalice, the receptacle for the blood, and his journey to Lightning Flat the quest. And Jack is the dead knight, killed by the dragon of hatred.

I love the Arthur myths and legends - sorry for dragging my obsessions into this. It just seems to fit.
Logged

Offline MississaugaRed

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 3641
  • Gender: Female
  • Gone too soon, but never forgotten.
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #165 on: Jul 26, 2006, 03:12 PM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 26, 2006, 02:43 PM
So Ennis becomes the knight, the one worthy to find the grail, and the shirts become the chalice, the receptacle for the blood, and his journey to Lightning Flat the quest. And Jack is the dead knight, killed by the dragon of hatred.

I love the Arthur myths and legends - sorry for dragging my obsessions into this. It just seems to fit.

Works well for me, ww ... drag away.  It does fit, disconcertingly well ... 

Although now I'm seeing Brokeback as Camelot, their quarter horses as noble steeds, their campfire as the round table, picture Ennis's simple garments as a suit of armor ...  was this a take on the Arthurian legend in disguise??  ww, I think you may have opened a whole new thread with that analogy!  O0
Logged
"Tha mo bhàta-foluaimein loma-làn easgannan".
My hovercraft is full of eels.

“I miss you,” Jack whispered. “I miss you.” He felt loved. He felt heard. Shades of Grey by MidwestGirl

Offline gimmejack

  • Alma
  • ****
  • Posts: 331
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #166 on: Jul 26, 2006, 04:28 PM »
Quote
Now I'm starting to prefer thinking of the shirts has being protected in that part of Jack's closet rather than hidden.  Hidden would imply to me that maybe they were never meant to be found.  Where they had rested all that time says to me they were being shielded from careless eyes, but were not meant to be so concealed that they couldn't be claimed when the right person, the one worthy, came seeking  ...
   :\'(  So true and well said
Logged
"Who would give a law to lovers? Love is unto itself a higher law."
~Boethius~

Offline LuvJackNasty

  • Mod-ChickY Brigade
  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 26177
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #167 on: Jul 26, 2006, 07:31 PM »
Quote from: keren_b on Jul 26, 2006, 09:34 AM
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 26, 2006, 09:24 AM
There's a way of seeing the shirts as Jack's "message in a bottle" to Ennis. He could hardly leave him a letter ( in the careof Lureen or his parents?) but the shirts look on the surface just like two shirts, even if theone inside had been discovered. The only person they have significance for is Enns.I wonder if Jack had a presentimetn or idea that he might die young/be kiiled?

I've never thought about it... but I don't think that was on Jack's mind, or that he expected Ennis to find the shirts. I always thought he kept them together like that because he wanted to remember the way they were together that summer on brokeback, and he put Ennis's shirt inside of his because he felt that Ennis was an inseperable part of him, inside him, like the story says - like two skins, one inside the other, two in one. he arranged the shirts the way he wanted him and Ennis to be in real life - one inside the other, two in one.

Beautiful posts everyone.  :\'(
Logged
“What Jack remembered and craved in a way he could neither help nor understand was the time that distant summer on Brokeback when Ennis had come up behind him and pulled him close, the silent embrace satisfying some shared and sexless hunger."

You may say I'm a dreamer But I'm not the only one I hope someday you'll join us And the world will live as one ~ Imagine- J. Lennon

Offline tpe

  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 96691
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #168 on: Jul 27, 2006, 07:37 AM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 26, 2006, 02:43 PM
So Ennis becomes the knight, the one worthy to find the grail, and the shirts become the chalice, the receptacle for the blood, and his journey to Lightning Flat the quest. And Jack is the dead knight, killed by the dragon of hatred.

I love the Arthur myths and legends - sorry for dragging my obsessions into this. It just seems to fit.

It took me a while to find this passage.  Read it as you see fit. 

"Sir," saith he, "The knight that assieged them maimed me in this fashion, but was himself maimed in such sort that he is dead thereof. But the wounds that he dealt me are so cruel and so raging, that they may not be healed save his sword toucheth them and if be not bound with some of the winding-sheet wherein he was shrouded, that he had displayed about him, all bloody."

(The History of the Holy Graal)


Logged

Offline Patriot1

  • BBM. What could possibly top it?
  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 2527
  • Gender: Male
  • In loving memory of Matthew Shepard 1976 - 1998
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #169 on: Jul 27, 2006, 04:04 PM »
Quote from: NoReins on Jul 26, 2006, 11:07 AM
I actually just realised something: when Ennis goes to send the "you bet" postcard to Jack, he has Jack's address written on a scrap of paper but Jack wrote his address on the postcard so Ennis could have just taken that with him to the post office.

Not sure if it matters to the discussion NoReins, but Jack's address was not on the post card he sent to Ennis.  On the one side was a picture of a mountain and on the other was Ennis' address, albeit General Delivery, and the words, "Friend, this letter is long overdue. Coming through on the 24th. Drop me a line say if you're there. Jack". Ennis did have Jack's address written on brown paper.  In another thread we discussed how Ennis would have gotten Jack's address seeing he was so thoughtless and did not put it on the postcard. I believe the concensus was that Ennis got it from the telephone company. Back in those days the telephone company would not only give you the number, but would give you the address the telephone was registered to, if that information was available. Jack owned a house, he had a telephone, so that information was easy to get. Of course it would have been better if he had put it on the post card, but...



Logged
Tell you what...truth is, sometimes I miss you so much I can hardly stand it...

Love is a force of nature.

Offline NoReins

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 7677
  • Gender: Female
  • Redlined it all the way
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #170 on: Jul 28, 2006, 02:49 AM »
Quote from: Patriot1 on Jul 27, 2006, 04:04 PM
Quote from: NoReins on Jul 26, 2006, 11:07 AM
I actually just realised something: when Ennis goes to send the "you bet" postcard to Jack, he has Jack's address written on a scrap of paper but Jack wrote his address on the postcard so Ennis could have just taken that with him to the post office.

Not sure if it matters to the discussion NoReins, but Jack's address was not on the post card he sent to Ennis.  On the one side was a picture of a mountain and on the other was Ennis' address, albeit General Delivery, and the words, "Friend, this letter is long overdue. Coming through on the 24th. Drop me a line say if you're there. Jack". Ennis did have Jack's address written on brown paper.  In another thread we discussed how Ennis would have gotten Jack's address seeing he was so thoughtless and did not put it on the postcard. I believe the concensus was that Ennis got it from the telephone company. Back in those days the telephone company would not only give you the number, but would give you the address the telephone was registered to, if that information was available. Jack owned a house, he had a telephone, so that information was easy to get. Of course it would have been better if he had put it on the post card, but...





D'oh %&) You know, I'd never even noticed that the address wasn't on the card....think I'm always too caught up with watching Ennis' face when he's reading it to actually look at the card.

Thanks, Patriot1.
Logged
He will be eternally missed, but he will never be forgotten

Christopher Nolan, accepting the Best Supporting Actor Golden Globe on Heath's behalf.

He was, as an actor and a professional and a human being, one of a kind

Charles Roven, accepting Heath's BAFTA.

This award tonight would have humbly validated Heath's quiet determination to be truly accepted by you all here — his peers within an industry he so loved.

Kim Ledger, accepting Heath's Oscar.

Offline welshwitch

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 6480
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #171 on: Jul 28, 2006, 08:09 AM »
There are so many details that demand the willing suspension of disbelief - how Ennis got to Lightning Flat to find the shirts is another one, since I can't imagine Jack gave him the address.I suppose we have to assume the existence of phone books, mail services, directories, etc - it's just that neither seems the type to use reference sources or ask other people for info - Ennis certainly wouldn't want to draw attention to himself that way.
Logged

Offline MississaugaRed

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 3641
  • Gender: Female
  • Gone too soon, but never forgotten.
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #172 on: Jul 28, 2006, 08:44 AM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 28, 2006, 08:09 AM
There are so many details that demand the willing suspension of disbelief - how Ennis got to Lightning Flat to find the shirts is another one, since I can't imagine Jack gave him the address.I suppose we have to assume the existence of phone books, mail services, directories, etc - it's just that neither seems the type to use reference sources or ask other people for info - Ennis certainly wouldn't want to draw attention to himself that way.

True, ww ...

Although ... he drew attention to himself by calling Lureen ... ???  so just the suspicion of Jack's death was already causing Ennis to act in ways he might not have thought he could before ...

As to how they were finding each other, I guess why waste precious film/story time on mundane details like how they worked out the getting addresses when we just want to see the results of address-getting.   :) 

Can't imagine LF was a very big place in terms of population; may have been conversations with Jack during all those times when details of his home came out, anyway.  Think maybe these country men were used to finding their way around these empty spaces with little to go on, given that time and place. 

This was important to Ennis, I like to think he would have steeled himself to ask directions if need be.  Important thing is Ennis found his way to LF, and those shirts were waiting .. Ennis journey to the shirts actaully started the minute he made that call to Lureen, the call we wouldn't have believed him capable of making.
Logged
"Tha mo bhàta-foluaimein loma-làn easgannan".
My hovercraft is full of eels.

“I miss you,” Jack whispered. “I miss you.” He felt loved. He felt heard. Shades of Grey by MidwestGirl

Offline welshwitch

  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 6480
  • Gender: Female
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #173 on: Jul 28, 2006, 02:39 PM »
He didn't know what he was going to find, but he must have known it wouldn't be easy going to Jack's parents' home. Having made himself make the call, he then had to make himself make the journey - the shirts were by way of a reward and perhaps showed him that the unexpected can follow if you break your patterns. Which he does again when he agrees to go to Alma Jr's wedding.
Logged

Offline BBBOY

  • Brokeback Junkie
  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 16628
  • Gender: Male
  • Ya know I ain't straight Me neither
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #174 on: Jul 30, 2006, 11:12 PM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 28, 2006, 02:39 PM
He didn't know what he was going to find, but he must have known it wouldn't be easy going to Jack's parents' home. Having made himself make the call, he then had to make himself make the journey - the shirts were by way of a reward and perhaps showed him that the unexpected can follow if you break your patterns. Which he does again when he agrees to go to Alma Jr's wedding.

 O0 Spot on pretty lady.
Logged
There was some open space between what he knew and what he tried to believe, but nothing could be done about it, and if you can't fix it you've got to stand it.

Ennis, riding against the wind back to the sheep in the treacherous, drunken darken light, thought he'd never had such a good time, felt he could paw the white out of the moon.

Offline jeffjoe

  • My name is Joe... Jeff Joe
  • Ennis
  • ******
  • Posts: 1756
  • Gender: Male
  • The magic is in us here...
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #175 on: Jul 27, 2007, 11:20 PM »
Quote from: welshwitch on Jul 28, 2006, 02:39 PM
He didn't know what he was going to find, but he must have known it wouldn't be easy going to Jack's parents' home. Having made himself make the call, he then had to make himself make the journey - the shirts were by way of a reward and perhaps showed him that the unexpected can follow if you break your patterns. Which he does again when he agrees to go to Alma Jr's wedding.

 <^( more than right
Logged
Nunca me alejo, mas allá de una mirada...

Offline Matt Nasty

  • formerly zankou1991
  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 13666
  • Country: 00
  • Gender: Male
  • I LOVE JAKE
what the shirts symbolise to you in the final scene(s)
« Reply #176 on: Feb 22, 2008, 02:46 PM »
hi the title practically sums up what im asking. to me when ennis finds his blood stained shirt in jacks closet inside one of jacks jackets its not just symbolical because it shows jack craved ennis so much he needed to keep something with him at all times the main thing the shirts symbolise to me is in the final scene with ennis saying jack i swear i noticed that he had switched the to be over the jacket to me the shirt and jacket were a metaphor in jacks room when the jacket was over the shirt it was in away embrasing the shirt a metaphor for jack embrassing his love for ennis and the fact that ennis put the jacket over the shirt for me was a metaphor that ennis had finally embrasses his love for jack. if i didnt make sence there please ask me to elaborate i feel strongly about this and would hate for people to not understand what im saying
« Last Edit: Feb 22, 2008, 06:16 PM by zankou1991 »
Logged

Offline chameau

  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 28148
  • Gender: Male
  • Miss ya little darlin'
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #177 on: Feb 22, 2008, 05:47 PM »
We merged your thread to this existing one so you could read what was discussed before :)
Logged
La dictature c'est ''ferme ta geule'', la démocratie c'est ''cause toujours''
 Jean-Louis Barrault

Offline Matt Nasty

  • formerly zankou1991
  • Jack + Ennis
  • *
  • Posts: 13666
  • Country: 00
  • Gender: Male
  • I LOVE JAKE
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #178 on: Feb 22, 2008, 05:52 PM »
Quote from: chameau on Feb 22, 2008, 05:47 PM
We merged your thread to this existing one so you could read what was discussed before :)

thanks again ive made a habit of that today sorry for the inconveinience
Logged

Offline chameau

  • Moderator
  • Jack + Ennis
  • ***
  • Posts: 28148
  • Gender: Male
  • Miss ya little darlin'
Re: Until the shirts / the shirts in the closet
« Reply #179 on: Feb 22, 2008, 06:12 PM »
No need to be sorry, there are so many threads here to explore :P
Logged
La dictature c'est ''ferme ta geule'', la démocratie c'est ''cause toujours''
 Jean-Louis Barrault
Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 8   Go Up
« previous next »