Topic: Jack's postcards *spoilers*

[Rønnaug]

*SPOILERS*


Something occurred to me after I went to bed last night. When Ennis is talking to Lureen on the phone she tells him that "yes I would have let you know what happened but I wasn't sure about your address, Jack kept his friends addresses in his head".

What happened to the postcards that Ennis sent to Jack? At least the first one had Ennis address on it.

a) Jack threw them away. Being afraid that someone would find them and figure out what this was about.
This is silly, as they most likely consisted of you bets and yeps, or the occasional "august is fine for our next fishing trip"

b)Lureen found them and threw them away, as she figured out what they meant, hoping that Ennis would never find out.
Also silly as she would figure out that any card Jack might have sent would be returned with deceased on it. Second, we know from both Anne H. and Ang L. that Lureen realized the nature of their relationship when she talked to Ennis on the phone and she connected him to Brokeback as Jacks favourite place

c) She obviously knew about Ennis as a fishing buddy, from her comment during the smoke and blue parka-thon we know that she knew about the fishingtrips and how often they occured. So why not send a card General Delivery like Jack that first time?

Bugging me a little bit... any thoughts?

[welshwitch]

She had no intention of letting Ennis know and did nothing till he rang, then told a socially-acceptable lie, and one that Ennis couldn't easily disprove? He was hardly going to say, "Why didn't you look for the postcards I sent him?"

I don't think Lureen does feelings much - Jack's comment about their marriage ("We could do it over the phone") says that to me. When you see her on the end of the phone she hardly looks like the grieving widow - if I had to guess I'd say she's thrown out anything to do with Jack, found another salesman for the business and is getting on with her life.

[froggy]

And that last postcard had to be returned, and who else than Lureen could do that, it's not like they were separated or that a widow does not get her husband's mail anymore, just because he is dead.

Or maybe he had already left the house, to leave with Randall!!!

[Rønnaug]

Haha@Froggy

the last postcard will have been stamped at the post office, Lureen wasn't THAT good with red ( notice the fingernails lol)

(and OT i know... Ennis for Mr. Brokeback 2007? Connected with mr gay syracuse 2002?)

[tpe]

Very interesting, Esme.

Part of me would like to think that Jack destroyed all material evidence regarding Ennis.  But I suspect that this was not the case.  For a person to keep 2 shirts for nearly 20 years in the closet does not seem to agree with the idea of Jack throwing away all evidence.

I suspect that he kept some of the correspondence in a secret place -- or a place he thought secret.  After all, the postcards were innocent enough. The underlying meaning was not obvious in each one, no? 

What was the fate of this material?  Perhpas Lureen indeed destroyed them after Jack's death.  I find this likely after she had talked with Ennis.  After that phone conversation, I am sure that she knew who Ennis was.  She probably would not have liked keeping the material around after that...

[Rønnaug]

Very interesting, Esme.

Part of me would like to think that Jack destroyed all material evidence regarding Ennis.  But I suspect that this was not the case.  For a person to keep 2 shirts for nearly 20 years in the closet does not seem to agree with the idea of Jack throwing away all evidence.

Very good point...hadn't thought of that. And following that thought I would dare to say that at least the first one, the YOU BET one, would be kept, and we know Ennis signed his name and address on that.



actually, it is the same address as the one from Jack, only without the General Delivery on it

[tpe]

I think the succeeding postcards must have had Ennis's true address, no?  The first one is indeed GENRAL DELIVERY (I remember the spelling).
 
I would also expect that Jack must have kept other mementos, especially in the later years when it became harder and harder to pin Ennis down.  This should include all forms of correspondence, no?

[froggy]

Yeah but how come the card is stamped "Deceased"
Does that mean that it was never sent to Lureen's house, it stopped at the post office and they then sent it back, without Lureen every seeing it?



(OT: YES!!)

[Rønnaug]

it was never sent to Lureen's house, it stopped at the post office and they then sent it back, without Lureen every seeing it?

This is what I think ... think it is still like that

(OT...well ok, fairs fair... )

[carbyville]

Very interesting, Esme.

Part of me would like to think that Jack destroyed all material evidence regarding Ennis.  But I suspect that this was not the case.  For a person to keep 2 shirts for nearly 20 years in the closet does not seem to agree with the idea of Jack throwing away all evidence.

That was my immediate thought, tpe. I don't want to say that Jack hung on to every little bit of Ennis he could (which he may have) we never really got much glimpse into his home life like we did with Ennis, but he definitely wouldn't throw them away because he was scared someone would discover them and figure out the nature of the relationship. That isn't Jack. He may or may not have thrown them out but it just would have been a natural thing like any other piece of mail, but not because he was trying to hide them. For all we know there could be a cigar box full of post cards nestled into a cubby hole in a home in Childress, Texas

As for Lureen... she didn't care about Jack's friends. Did Jack really have friends anyway? I believe he had acquaintances but I don't know about actual friends that he would go "hang out" with other than Ennis and Randall, but we know that was more than meets the eye. Going back to Lureen not telling Ennis; her facade went as far as LD Newsome's clientele. If Ennis lived in Childress and bought $100,000 tractors and farming equipment from them while maintaining a friendship/love affair with her husband, I'm sure he would have known quicker than he did. Ennis was many miles away, far too many miles for her to be concerned with. 

[tpe]

Froggy, do you remember a discussion about this a while back?  I think someone said it never got to Lureen.  That the post office must have just sent it back.  Would Lureen have destroyed it?  Probably not.  She would have been curious, I'm sure, to find out more about the fishing buddy.  I don't think she knew at that point, although I'm sure she knew more about Jack's double life...

[froggy]

Yes I remember it, but its nice to see it creeping up again. x

[tpe]

I know!  Everything ties in one way or the other.  Wonderful. 

[Rønnaug]

Couldn't remember if it had been discussed... and it started to bug me last night... the film creeps up on you when you least expect it...

[tpe]

Esme, I don't think the fate of the postcards was ever discussed in detail until now.  Yes, this topic has again set me wondering/speculating.

[froggy]

I don't remember one particular topic that is about the postcard only, this is a great thread, cant wait to read more!

[Rønnaug]

Well it was about bloody time then

I think I started thinking about it cause I got two ennisjack.com postcards sitting next to my comp..along with one from Capbreton.... wonder who it's from.

[froggy]

Those postcards!! They make you think of really amazing things

[Rønnaug]

They do..and postcards are so important in the film. apart from that one phonecall this is how they stay in touch... and like tpe said, Jack kept the shirts, and he kept them after the first summer. I am sure he saved all of Ennis he could to give him comfort during their time apart.

[tpe]

If they indeed survived Jack, they were all probably destroyed by Lureen after Jack's death.  That is such a sad thing to speculate upon...  It must have been like violating the dead (and the living, in the case of Ennis).

[Rønnaug]

Well Lureen didn't care about Jack, didn't even bring half the ashes to his parents, she sent it up. So why would she care about a bunch of postcards from a fishingbuddy?

[tpe]

Possibly because it may have wounded her pride.  That these are tokens from a human being Jack had preferred over her all along.

[carbyville]

Possibly because it may have wounded her pride.  That these are tokens from a human being Jack had preferred over her all along.

Never thought of it that way. Going on the knowledge that she doesn't realize the nature of Jack and Ennis's relationship until she talks to Ennis on the phone, I don't think she would have done anything to the postcards until then, but I'd imagine by the time Jack died, if he had kept the postcards at all he had them hidden and Lureen didn't know it.

[Rønnaug]

I think she went through Jacks stuff, like you would do after a husband dies, wether you loved him or not, and chuck everything out if you didn't care for him... although the way she is lying on the phone tells me she does know something about him preferring men... can't get this to click right in my head atm...

[tpe]

Never thought of it that way. Going on the knowledge that she doesn't realize the nature of Jack and Ennis's relationship until she talks to Ennis on the phone, I don't think she would have done anything to the postcards until then, but I'd imagine by the time Jack died, if he had kept the postcards at all he had them hidden and Lureen didn't know it.

Quite right.  I had forgotten that nice detail!  

Nonetheless, she may have destroyed any form of correspondence she could have laid her hands on.  I would assume he suspected all of Jack's male acquaintances by then.  It was probably in her best interest to hush the whole thing up.  And perhaps she also had Bobby in mind...

[Rønnaug]

Don't think she had Bobbys best interest in mind, she didn't come across as THAT much of a caring mother... Think she was more concerned for her own reputation and that of the business

[tpe]

I think she went through Jacks stuff, like you would do after a husband dies, wether you loved him or not, and chuck everything out if you didn't care for him... although the way she is lying on the phone tells me she does know something about him preferring men... can't get this to click right in my head atm...

If we put ourselves in Lureen's situation, what would we have done?  I'm afraid I would have probably done the very same thing I suggested that she did.  It must have been a humiliation knowing that Jack was cheating on her, and with other men, at that.  Then again, she probably didn't care so long as everything did not come out in the open.  A murder would have aired the dirty laundry, and she was quick to move to protect her own...

[tpe]

Don't think she had Bobbys best interest in mind, she didn't come across as THAT much of a caring mother... Think she was more concerned for her own reputation and that of the business

This is probably true, although I recoil in a bit of horror to think of a mother without a modicum of caring for her son's reputation.

[Rønnaug]

But then I would have thrown out postcards from a fishing buddy even if I loved my husband...

[tpe]

But then I would have thrown out postcards from a fishing buddy even if I loved my husband...

On the practical side, this is quite plausible.  She didn't have to know anything about Jack.  It's the natural tendency of survivors to hide or dispose of many of the personal effects of the departed to speed up the process of healing and move on...