Author Topic: Two similar scenes (spoiler)  (Read 102279 times)

greenfrog

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #60 on: Mar 12, 2007, 02:12 AM »
Follow-up to the "Ennis in trucks" scenes -- Ennis & Paper Sacks.



I think he may even have exactly the same jacket.
« Last Edit: Mar 12, 2007, 07:19 AM by tpe »

Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #61 on: Mar 12, 2007, 07:13 AM »
How bout the two scenes: Jack rounds the corner in a black truck to find Ennis that next summer at Aguirre's, and Ennis rounds he corner in a black truck returning home to find the the first post card from Jack after 4 f--kin years. Attempted "rediscovery" on both sides.

Very nice, aintfoolin !  I like this correspondence!


Offline jackster

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #62 on: Mar 13, 2007, 09:34 PM »
I think he may even have exactly the same jacket.

Sorry greenfrog, they're very similar, but different coats. In '63 Ennis is wearing a Carhartt Chore Coat #C01, in brown. In '83 at Jack's folks he's wearing a Dickies Chore Coat #3439 in black (but they look gray). These utilitarian coats are very similar in design but of course by different manufacturers. In the shot with Ennis's father he (his father) is also wearing a Carhartt Chore Coat, but in dark blue. All of these coats are "classic" American workwear and are still available today (easy finds on ebay) in virtually the same style as in '53 (when Ennis was 9), '63 when Ennis was 19, and '83 when Ennis was 39. I may be prejudiced, but I think he's incredibly sexy in that brown coat.
 O0
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Offline ksxks

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #63 on: Mar 14, 2007, 12:14 AM »
:)  I love that you know these garment specifics, jackster!

kathy
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #64 on: Mar 14, 2007, 07:05 AM »
:)  I love that you know these garment specifics, jackster!

kathy

Same here!  Wonderul information about the coats!

 

Offline jackster

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #65 on: Mar 14, 2007, 09:05 AM »
:)  I love that you know these garment specifics, jackster!

kathy

Gee, I hope you don't think I'm being obsessive or anything about this movie. ;)

Ennis in '63 in his Carhartt coat:


Ennis in '83 in his Dickies coat:


I don't think this is too off topic as the similarity of his clothes, even twenty years later, shows how consistent - or some might say rigid, he was in his own self image, be that good OR bad.

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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #66 on: Mar 14, 2007, 09:50 AM »
jackster, I wonder if we should start a new thread all about the clothes used in the various BBM scenes!

I think it is a whole topic in and of itself... :)


Offline jackster

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #67 on: Mar 14, 2007, 11:16 AM »
jackster, I wonder if we should start a new thread all about the clothes used in the various BBM scenes!

I think it is a whole topic in and of itself... :)


Well, I dunno, ya could. Obviously in THIS movie, more than any other movie I can think of, there were two shirts that you could say got top billing and provided the raison d'etre for the film. On the other hand, the outfits are really pretty minimal as movies go, but this is not to say without meaning. I believe the wardrobe was chosen with as much care and intelligence as is shown in the rest of the film. Being mostly all vernacular clothing it might be interesting to see what folks think about the styles and pieces chosen.

jackster
« Last Edit: Mar 14, 2007, 05:04 PM by jackster »
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #68 on: Mar 14, 2007, 04:39 PM »
Well, I dunno, ya could. Obviously in THIS movie, more than any other movie I can think of, there were two shirts that you could say got top billing and provided the raison d'etre for the film. On the other hand, the outfits are really pretty minimal as movies go, but this is not to say without meaning. I believe the wardrobe was chosen with as much care and intelligence as the is shown in the rest of the film. Being mostly all vernacular clothing it might be interesting to see what folks think about the styles and pieces chosen.

jackster

I do agree that the wardrobe was very carefully chosen and that they were full of meaning as far as the wearers were concerned.

There was an old thread dealing with the colors of Ennis's and Jack's clothing.  But I do agree that there is more meaning that can be drawn from the clothes themselves, and not just the colors.

I will leave it up to you.  It looks to me that you have a lot to share and comment upon regarding this topic...

Offline ksxks

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #69 on: Mar 15, 2007, 12:14 AM »
Gee, I hope you don't think I'm being obsessive or anything about this movie. ;)
...
I don't think this is too off topic as the similarity of his clothes, even twenty years later, shows how consistent - or some might say rigid, he was in his own self image, be that good OR bad.

jackster

No, I for one certainly don't think you're too obsessive!!  There are certain other details I am very obsessive about, also.  I love all the details -- and obviously Ang Lee did, too -- wanting to make sure the movie reads correctly.

Anyway, I don't know that Ennis's jackets really say too much about him personally.  I think it's just that in men's clothes in particular (not city clothes) there is simply a utilitarian element, and styles have no reason to be changed.  We might look at jeans as another example.  Only in last decades of 1900's did jeans become subject to significant style changes, but basically, men's jeans are men's jeans, and you can still get the plain, basic style.  Anyway, the jackets that a working man such as Ennis would wear, the styles would remain the same, when the styles "work" and don't need to be changed.  Or denim overalls.  Or work boots.  Anything like that.  (I'm envious of men's clothes -- "Madison Avenue" makes sure that women's clothes change twice or more a year to keep women constantly buying!)  Also, even into 80's Ennis might not have access to all sorts of new-style clothes -- he would just go to Sears or his local farm mercantile and get a new jacket to replace the other one after 20 years!

Now who's obsessed, huh?

kathy
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Offline ksxks

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #70 on: Mar 15, 2007, 12:14 AM »
jackster, I wonder if we should start a new thread all about the clothes used in the various BBM scenes!

I think it is a whole topic in and of itself... :)


So do I!

kathy
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #71 on: Mar 15, 2007, 07:55 AM »
So do I!

kathy

OT: jackster, if you lead, we will follow.  :)


Offline LuvJackNasty

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #72 on: Jul 08, 2007, 12:25 PM »
I noticed something in the shirts scene I never noticed before (I think the crying has something to do with that  ::)). I never noticed before that the shirts were backwards in Jack's closet- backwards meaning the fronts of the shirts were against the wall facing towards the front of the closet.  The shirts were facing backwards to Ennis almost as if Jack had his back to Ennis. I started to think that Jack was hugging them maybe like the Dozy Embrace or maybe just happened to hang them up that way. But Ennis once again comes up from behind Jack but turns them around to be "face to face" with Jack- the acknowledgement that he wanted to hold Jack that way, that he can admit that it was a man he held.  :\'( The goodbye he should have given him that last day instead of the punch.  It's sort of a pendant scene to the Dozy Embrace. The DE is Jack's shirts scene in a way. Holding on to something that was and never will be again. Clinging to something and trying to will it into being.. :\'(
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Offline ksxks

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #73 on: Jul 08, 2007, 11:10 PM »
This is totally beautiful, LJN.  I didn't catch this significance before.  The way they hung in Jack's closet, and then the way Ennis embraced them, front to front.  So poignant...

kathy
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #74 on: Jul 09, 2007, 07:55 AM »
This is totally beautiful, LJN.  I didn't catch this significance before.  The way they hung in Jack's closet, and then the way Ennis embraced them, front to front.  So poignant...

kathy

I second kathy here.  LJN, that was beautiful.  Thanks.


Offline aintfoolin

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #75 on: Jul 09, 2007, 08:20 AM »
I see two similar scenes where in the reunion scene there is a multi-colored coat hanging on a hook in Alma and Ennis's entrance hall and a multi-colored coat  is seen hanging in Jack's closet too. Can't tell if it's the same one or not but this similar coat is seen in both instances
 
 And yes, LJN, it seems to be the only coat-hanger facing that way. I agree, this was beautifully put into words. Ennis also stares at the top of the hanger where Jack's face would be. Maybe he sees Jack's face or is picturing it in his mind at this moment.
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Offline jackster

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #76 on: Jul 09, 2007, 05:29 PM »
I see two similar scenes where in the reunion scene there is a multi-colored coat hanging on a hook in Alma and Ennis's entrance hall and a multi-colored coat  is seen hanging in Jack's closet too. Can't tell if it's the same one or not but this similar coat is seen in both instances

Yeah, I noticed those two similar coats about the third time I watched. I'm pretty sure it's not the same one, different trim details as I recall. But it is really curious that there would be two coats so very similar, and they are easily spotted as such by even a casual observer, so it must have been intentional by the movie makers. Why? One is '67 in the DelMar apartment and then another, 16 years later in Jack's closet. ? Jack's bedspread is also a multi-color, patchwork affair but different from the coats. ???
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #77 on: Jul 10, 2007, 06:58 AM »
There are at least 3 scenes in the movie that show Ennis and a closet/wardrobe, no?  The first is when he is shown packing to leave for the mountains with Jack.  The second is in Jack's closet in the Twist house.  The third is in his trailer at the end of the movie.

Somehow, I sense a visual connection with these scenes, in that Ennis shows that peculiar habit of smelling the clothes...


Offline aintfoolin

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #78 on: Jul 10, 2007, 02:52 PM »
This is true, He did smell several items of clothing during the movie. Perhaps his sense of smel did give him an association visiualy to whomever he was thinking about at the time. ( Alma JR.'s sweater is a good example and of course the two shirts in the closet. He even smelled his own clothing while packing for the mountains!! Sorry , this is sort of OT.
..."yet he is suffused with a sense of pleasure because Jack Twist was in his dream"...

Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #79 on: Jul 11, 2007, 06:59 AM »
This is true, He did smell several items of clothing during the movie. Perhaps his sense of smel did give him an association visiualy to whomever he was thinking about at the time. ( Alma JR.'s sweater is a good example and of course the two shirts in the closet. He even smelled his own clothing while packing for the mountains!! Sorry , this is sort of OT.

Yes, I believe so: it gave him a sense of connection -- the senses acting as external stimulii to something deeper.  IT gave the 3 scenes some common feel...

OT: there was a thread that discussed this peculiar practice of Ennis (smelling the clothing)...


Offline Daniblondy

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #80 on: Jul 15, 2007, 07:13 AM »
Kathy and tpe -- I'm glad to share!  :)  I was actually thinking of starting a thread for pictures of bookend or parallel scenes but if this thread is okay then I'll post here.

Here are a couple scenes (SNIT just before their first kiss, and first reunion just after the big kiss) that while not necessarily related plot-wise, turned out almost identical visually.



I never noticed that.

Well Never thought of those 2 scenes as that "Similair" and I have watched them both prolly more than 30 times each  ::) ;D

Bad Dani  :8 (t)

Offline aintfoolin

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #81 on: Jul 15, 2007, 11:41 AM »
I just love the way their hands carress and lold each other's faces. You just know this is love, no doubt about it.
..."yet he is suffused with a sense of pleasure because Jack Twist was in his dream"...

Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #82 on: Jul 16, 2007, 07:45 AM »
I just love the way their hands carress and lold each other's faces. You just know this is love, no doubt about it.

Two similar and dissimilar scenes regarding this: the way they hold to their faces in the FNIT and SNIT.  IN a sense, they are so different from each other -- but there is an underlying similarity that we recognize below the surface: akin to a sense of exploration, I guess.


Offline ksxks

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #83 on: Jul 17, 2007, 12:30 AM »
I never made this connection, but this similarity was in the video "The Maker Makes" (by parkerdude2003).  It showed Ennis looking at the gutted sheep, then flashed back to seeing "gutted" Earl in the ditch.  Even more of a connection considering how Ennis was feeling, what he was thinking about, when he rode up and saw that dead sheep.  Intense...

kathy 
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Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #84 on: Jul 17, 2007, 07:29 AM »
I never made this connection, but this similarity was in the video "The Maker Makes" (by parkerdude2003).  It showed Ennis looking at the gutted sheep, then flashed back to seeing "gutted" Earl in the ditch.  Even more of a connection considering how Ennis was feeling, what he was thinking about, when he rode up and saw that dead sheep.  Intense...

kathy 

Yes, I do agree that there is a parallel.  And there is yet a third that joins the two to the final resolution: the scene showing jack being murdered.




Offline welshwitch

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #85 on: Jul 17, 2007, 11:53 AM »
I quite like the parallel in the Thanksgiving scenes, where Monroe is clearly head of the household and does the carving. Jack has to fight LD and assert hisposition, but ends up carving too. There's also the nice touch of Jack hacking away with a kitchen knife while Monroe wields his electric carving knife - for some reason that al;ways makes me smile. Men and their love of gadgets, I suppose.

Offline tpe

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #86 on: Jul 17, 2007, 03:38 PM »
I quite like the parallel in the Thanksgiving scenes, where Monroe is clearly head of the household and does the carving. Jack has to fight LD and assert hisposition, but ends up carving too. There's also the nice touch of Jack hacking away with a kitchen knife while Monroe wields his electric carving knife - for some reason that al;ways makes me smile. Men and their love of gadgets, I suppose.

It makes me smile too.  Jack's, because he finally regains the respectability of being pater familias; Monroe's because he seemed so "out of it" -- not saying a word through it all and seemingly preoccupied with the carving and nothing else...

Offline Chico

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #87 on: Jul 17, 2007, 06:27 PM »
I see parallels among the gutted sheep, Earl in the ditch, Monroe and Alma's T'giving turkey with it's gutted cavity toward the camera, and the Black Hole that Jack walks into with the male prostitute in Mexico.   
'You know, it could be like this, just like this...always."

"Well, what's the point of ridin' a piece a stock fer eight seconds?"   *Grin*

"Our husbands ain't  the least bit interested in dancin'.  They ain't got a smidgeon a rhythm between 'em!"

(Ennis) "Well, speak fer yerself.  You may be a sinner, but I ain't yet had the opportunity."   (Jack) "Hmmm," handing Ennis the whiskey bottle.  *he chuckles* "

Offline welshwitch

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #88 on: Jul 17, 2007, 06:30 PM »
All of them a version of the mouth of hell? Among the painted pieces of scenery in the inventory of an Elizabethan acting company  is "One Mouth of Hell" but I'm sure that one had flames in red and yellow around it.

Offline Chico

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Re: Two similar scenes (spoiler)
« Reply #89 on: Jul 17, 2007, 07:19 PM »
Yes, the "Mouth of Hell".  That describes it pefectly, welshwitch!  Excellently put!
'You know, it could be like this, just like this...always."

"Well, what's the point of ridin' a piece a stock fer eight seconds?"   *Grin*

"Our husbands ain't  the least bit interested in dancin'.  They ain't got a smidgeon a rhythm between 'em!"

(Ennis) "Well, speak fer yerself.  You may be a sinner, but I ain't yet had the opportunity."   (Jack) "Hmmm," handing Ennis the whiskey bottle.  *he chuckles* "