Brokeback Mountain Forum @ ennisjack.com
The Movie & Story => Characters, Quotes & Scenes => Topic started by: Laundrymat on Feb 09, 2006, 03:28 AM
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There’s one particular scene I really like...
When Jack’s dad was telling Ennis about jack’s idea with the “texas ranch neighbor “. It was devastating. But during the whole conversation, Jack’s mom was standing next to Ennis and as soon as the angry old man stopped talking, she put her hand on Ennis’s shoulder and told him to visit the room. (I found it very warm comfy feeling although the whole room was full of cold atmosphere)
Mom knows the shirts were there and understand how important to Ennis (I’d like to call her son-in-law) Ok, when the son-in-law of Mrs. Twist came down from Jack’s room. She was kinda relief and hand the paper bag to him without asking. She even ignored the old man and asked Ennis to come back again. (When I was watching this scene, I felt like a rock on my chest. Didn’t quiet understand why at that moment. But now I think I get it. Mrs.Twist!! You rock!! )
Mr. Ang Lee was right. This movie is about love, a simple love no matter what kind.
I apologize for my poor English writing. I hope you guys didn’t get confused and am always open for any corrections :D
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There’s one particular scene I really like...
When Jack’s dad was telling Ennis about jack’s idea with the “texas ranch neighbor “. It was devastating. But during the whole conversation, Jack’s mom was standing next to Ennis and as soon as the angry old man stopped talking, she put her hand on Ennis’s shoulder and told him to visit the room. (I found it very warm comfy feeling although the whole room was full of cold atmosphere)
Mom knows the shirts were there and understand how important to Ennis (I’d like to call her son-in-law) Ok, when the son-in-law of Mrs. Twist came down from Jack’s room. She was kinda relief and hand the paper bag to him without asking. She even ignored the old man and asked Ennis to come back again. (When I was watching this scene, I felt like a rock on my chest. Didn’t quiet understand why at that moment. But now I think I get it. Mrs.Twist!! You rock!! )
Mr. Ang Lee was right. This movie is about love, a simple love no matter what kind.
I apologize for my poor English writing. I hope you guys didn’t get confused and am always open for any corrections :D
God, that scene wrecks me. Jack's dad, I swear he did it on purpose, because he knew of the relationship between Ennis and Jack. Did it to demean Ennis & Jack in one fell swoop. (Bastard). But Jack's mom putting her hand on his shoulder is something a caring and compassionate mother who feels a connection with Ennis over Jack would have done, simple gesture, but yet a powerful symbol of connectiveness.
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Must've really wrecked you, Cowboy, you posted twice, hehehehe. That scene is very powerful. The more I see it, the more I discover the compassion in Jack's mom. She's clearly had a less-than-perfect life (look at the dad...eek), plus she's supposed to be Pentocostal, but she gives Ennis all the sympathy she can convey through a few words, touches, smiles. :'(
camom
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You could see Ennis's embarrassment when Jack's father mentioned about Jack's plan to bring him up and "licked the ranch good" never came to fruition. :-[
It also somehow dawn to me that the Twist family pins all hopes onto that one son. He hated the pressure and fled for his freedom. Sounds like the lost kids in our generation? :-\
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You could see Ennis's embarrassment when Jack's father mentioned about Jack's plan to bring him up and "licked the ranch good" never came to fruition. :-[
It also somehow dawn to me that the Twist family pins all hopes onto that one son. He hated the pressure and fled for his freedom. Sounds like the lost kids in our generation? :-\
Even though Jack had an unpleasant childhood, but at the end he still wanted to go back to Lightning Flat and be his folk and take care of them. :(
sign...damn u Ennis...
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There’s one particular scene I really like...
When Jack’s dad was telling Ennis about jack’s idea with the “texas ranch neighbor “. It was devastating. But during the whole conversation, Jack’s mom was standing next to Ennis and as soon as the angry old man stopped talking, she put her hand on Ennis’s shoulder and told him to visit the room. (I found it very warm comfy feeling although the whole room was full of cold atmosphere)
Mom knows the shirts were there and understand how important to Ennis (I’d like to call her son-in-law) Ok, when the son-in-law of Mrs. Twist came down from Jack’s room. She was kinda relief and hand the paper bag to him without asking. She even ignored the old man and asked Ennis to come back again. (When I was watching this scene, I felt like a rock on my chest. Didn’t quiet understand why at that moment. But now I think I get it. Mrs.Twist!! You rock!! )
Mr. Ang Lee was right. This movie is about love, a simple love no matter what kind.
I apologize for my poor English writing. I hope you guys didn’t get confused and am always open for any corrections :D
God, that scene wrecks me. Jack's dad, I swear he did it on purpose, because he knew of the relationship between Ennis and Jack. Did it to demean Ennis & Jack in one fell swoop. (Bastard). But Jack's mom putting her hand on his shoulder is something a caring and compassionate mother who feels a connection with Ennis over Jack would have done, simple gesture, but yet a powerful symbol of connectiveness.
Thanks for posting this friends
This is one of the most human scene of the movie, Roberta Maxwell is just overwhelming. Whent she touches Ennis shoulder, and sends him to Jack bedroom... Her teary eye... Sob! :'(
(clenching teeth, still at work)
How come this beautyfull woman have such an *sshole of a husband?
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Laudrymat, thanks for the thought. This scene is my partner's favorite because it drew some tears from him. He didn't want to tell me why (so like Ennis)
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Wow! I was so wrapped up in Ennis' grief, that I never thought that Jack's mom might know the significance of Ennis to Jack....that's very profound. I'm just now getting intrigued with this scene more than the previous tear-jerker (the final scene with Ennis and Jack and the flashback to the perfect time when they were up on the mountain and all was well). My mother saw this film after I saw it and told me that this scene when Ennis visited Jack was the most moving scene for her. She felt sorry for Jack when she realized what a small, sad and difficult life he had come from - the abysmal, dysfunctional father, the horribly sterile house, the dying farm...and yet somehow Jack always had a smile on his face and hope in his heart.
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Laudrymat, thanks for the thought. This scene is my partner's favorite because it drew some tears from him. He didn't want to tell me why (so like Ennis)
I'll bet that bubu, he's a sweetheart just like you! :-*
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I'll bet that bubu, he's a sweetheart just like you! :-*
<OT> thank you, Cody. Yes..he just has difficulty of expressing it sometimes. ;)
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
She kind of accepted Ennis being her son in law? I guess so.
What a great Lady. I'd like to send her flowers.
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
She kind of accepted Ennis being her son in law? I guess so.
What a great Lady. I'd like to send her flowers.
She completely ignores Jack’s father. As soon as Ennis arrives, she only focuses on him. Offer refreshment; send him to Jack’s room…
If the angry old man was away somewhere, I guess Jack’s mother and her son-in-law would have some pleasant conversations. She likes Ennis before even know him.
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
She kind of accepted Ennis being her son in law? I guess so.
What a great Lady. I'd like to send her flowers.
She completely ignores Jack’s father. As soon as Ennis arrives, she only focuses on him. Offer refreshment; send him to Jack’s room…
If the angry old man was away somewhere, I guess Jack’s mother and her son-in-law would have some pleasant conversations. She likes Ennis before even know him.
Sob! :'(
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C'mere Chameau - I've got the shoulder for you and some kleenex! :'(
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C'mere Chameau - I've got the shoulder for you and some kleenex! :'(
It's alright, just alrright, I learned to manage with this.
Thanks BTW Comboy!
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
She kind of accepted Ennis being her son in law? I guess so.
What a great Lady. I'd like to send her flowers.
You can tell, when Ennis drives up, that she's been waiting for him, probably watching out of the window. When she comes outside to greet him, the old man's likely just sitting inside, glaring at the walls. Bet she just can't wait until he kicks the bucket.
camom
She completely ignores Jack’s father. As soon as Ennis arrives, she only focuses on him. Offer refreshment; send him to Jack’s room…
If the angry old man was away somewhere, I guess Jack’s mother and her son-in-law would have some pleasant conversations. She likes Ennis before even know him.
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The scene with Jack's mom was the knock out punch for me after Ennis's and Jack's fight. You could really tell she connectede to Ennis somehow. They both loved Jack.
She kind of accepted Ennis being her son in law? I guess so.
What a great Lady. I'd like to send her flowers.
You can tell, when Ennis drives up, that she's been waiting for him, probably watching out of the window. When she comes outside to greet him, the old man's likely just sitting inside, glaring at the walls. Bet she just can't wait until he kicks the bucket.
camom
She completely ignores Jack’s father. As soon as Ennis arrives, she only focuses on him. Offer refreshment; send him to Jack’s room…
If the angry old man was away somewhere, I guess Jack’s mother and her son-in-law would have some pleasant conversations. She likes Ennis before even know him.
OK, I've seen the movie and this scene 12 times now. The time before the last, I was going along, enjoying the way the whole thing unfolds inside me now, and when Jack's mother put her hand on Ennis and said "You are welcome to go up to his room, if you want," it felt like the kindest thing any person had ever said to another, and I cried for I don't know what. Like she was saying "You get to have the Jack you want, f**k that old geezer, I will share with you the Jack I have loved forever." I'm crying now thinking of the way she lifts her face ever so slightly....the woman has her dignity and Ennis is her witness. Beautiful, sad, sweet.
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I'm crying now thinking of the way she lifts her face ever so slightly....the woman has her dignity and Ennis is her witness. Beautiful, sad, sweet
Sending a virtual shoulder to spread tears on :'(
I'm crying too :'( :'( :'(
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I'm crying now thinking of the way she lifts her face ever so slightly....the woman has her dignity and Ennis is her witness. Beautiful, sad, sweet
Sending a virtual shoulder to spread tears on :'(
I'm crying too :'( :'( :'(
And me too...What a wonderful observation, jrfh :'( :'( :'(
This just occurred to me - Jack's real reason for going home was always to visit his Mom, not that SOB abusive father who must've been a wife beater as well. (notice how she has her back turned to Mr. Twist and winces and clutches at her collar as he says Jack's ashes are going in the family plot) Jack's idea of bringing Ennis to the ranch wasn't about helping John Sr., it was to ensure that he'd always be there for his Mama. Jack might have been the only person in her life who ever loved her. Keeping Jack's room the same as it was when he was a boy shows she adored him. The pain she must've felt when she found out he'd never be coming back again. No wonder she connected with Ennis and tells him to come back and see them.
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I loved this scene as well. Jack's Mom knew she had met the love of her son's life through all of Enniis' actions, his words, the tears, the thank you as he was leaving. In that meeting, she learned the answer to this silent question in her heart: Was my son ever loved by someone?. She got the answer she was hoping for, and acknowledged her acceptance with a touch on Ennis's shoulder and an invitation for him to return.
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There’s one particular scene I really like...
When Jack’s dad was telling Ennis about jack’s idea with the “texas ranch neighbor “. It was devastating. But during the whole conversation, Jack’s mom was standing next to Ennis and as soon as the angry old man stopped talking, she put her hand on Ennis’s shoulder and told him to visit the room. (I found it very warm comfy feeling although the whole room was full of cold atmosphere)
Mom knows the shirts were there and understand how important to Ennis (I’d like to call her son-in-law) Ok, when the son-in-law of Mrs. Twist came down from Jack’s room. She was kinda relief and hand the paper bag to him without asking. She even ignored the old man and asked Ennis to come back again. (When I was watching this scene, I felt like a rock on my chest. Didn’t quiet understand why at that moment. But now I think I get it. Mrs.Twist!! You rock!! )
Mr. Ang Lee was right. This movie is about love, a simple love no matter what kind.
I apologize for my poor English writing. I hope you guys didn’t get confused and am always open for any corrections :D
You are so right, Laundrymat. The unspoken dialog in that scene is heartbreaking. Both parents "know" about their son, they have diametrically opposed feelings on the matter, we walk away knowing this, although not one word is spoken of it. For my money, one of the best scenes on celluloid.
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Why I keep coming back to this thread :'(
Each time I just flood my keyboard, thanks for the great postings friends.
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I agree with all of the above..it is a beautifull sceen in all its sadness..
i just keep thinking, if she didn't know who Ennis was and what he ment to Jack then why would she send him up to Jacks room and why would she just let him take the shirts like that. so I think she knew, and she was happy to meet the man her son loved.
she must have known about the shirts, otherwise she would have found them and at least :) cleaned them
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this scene broke my heart! *sniff*
God bless Jack's mom!! she knew about her son and loved him very much! she hid the shirts in the closet so that when Ennis came, he'd take them! aww such a kind and sweet mother!
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this scene broke my heart! *sniff*
God bless Jack's mom!! she knew about her son and loved him very much! she hid the shirts in the closet so that when Ennis came, he'd take them! aww such a kind and sweet mother!
I think Jack hid them but she must have seen them, wont believe she never went up there and went through his things... at least after he died...i know I would
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I found this priceless Yahoo review on another BBM board and felt most here would enjoy it. (relevant to this thread because of the 5th paragraph) It's one of the most beautiful reflections on the film I've yet read.
The Older The Eyes............The Finer The Film
by txgrandpa65 Jan 10, 2006
My wife and I and our best friends all live in a small town in East Texas. Even though none of us will ever see 65 again we do love to see good movies and we depend on your reviews to help us make our choices. Most of the reviews talked about the visuals and the acting. The one common theme was that you can not leave this movie at the theater it follows you home and that intrigued us.
Last week we drove the two hours to Dallas to see the film. Our first moment of enjoyment was the look on the face of the ticket lady when we asked if the Senior Discount applied to Brokeback. As the movie begins you hear the mournful sound of the train whistle and you sense you are about to go on an amazing journey. And amazing it is. The visuals and the music take you quickly to a place of great beauty, peace, and solitude. The acting is first rate and you swear you actually know Alma, Ennis, Lureen, and Jack just seconds after they appear on the screen. Suffice to say we all four thought the movie was extremely well done and thought provoking.
We would like to give some observations fron the Senior viewpoint. First of all the sexual content of the movie. We were aware of the storyline and somewhat prepared and determined to sit through what ever it was. We all agreed however that we felt more uncomfortable with the sexual acrobatics of Halle Berry in "Monster's Ball" and the straiway scene in "The History of Violence" than the brief tent scenes. And the difference between the first night and the second tells you this is going to be more than drunk sex.
The obvious storyline is about Ennis and Jack but if you can step back and observe and absorb the whole story you will find so many wonderful stories within this story. One real gem is Lureen who proves Texas women don't get older just blonder. Her phone scene with Ennis is just amazing. She is forced to acknowledge that the voice on the other end of the line belongs to the person that owned the piece of her husbands heart that would never be hers. In a split second she has to decide to treat him with contempt or kindness. Anne Hathaway within these few minutes on the screen shows how really talented she is.
In our opinion one of the best parts in the entire movie occur when Ennis goes to the ranch of Jacks parents. Mrs. Twist feels an immediate connection with him and tries to mother him with Cherry cake and coffee. She has heard the name Ennis Del Mar often from Jack and in her heart of hearts she knows WHO he is. In order to confirm her thoughts she invites him to go up to Jacks childhood room knowing what Jack had put in the closet twenty years ago. As Ennis comes back down the stairs she sees the contents in his hand and knows there could be only one other person in the world except Jack that would know the importance of it. The look in her eyes and her small gestures as she hands him the sack is simply heartbreaking. You can almost hear that mother's heart shattered by the loss of a child scream out "I loved my boy Jack and I don't know and I don't care why you were so important to him but I know you were and I love you for it." But all she can actually say is that he is welcome back anytime. You can feel her total isolation as she watches him leave knowing she has just lost another piece of her son's life. Roberta Maxwell as Jacks mother is pure perfection.
If you decide to go see this movie you will get the chance to learn about love, loss, hate, fear, prejudice, loyalty and betrayal.The one single most important lesson is that we all have to make choices in this life. This has to be done with the most honest and truthful heart possible because no one is an island and your choices do and will affect other people.
If you loved it, or if you liked it, or if you thought it was just OK buy the DVD and every five or so years watch it again because the older the eyes the finer the film.
Well worth the money even without the Senior Discount.
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What a beautiful review of the movie. Thanks for sharring. Your words brought tears to my eyes again thinking about those scenes.....
:( :( :(
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In our opinion one of the best parts in the entire movie occur when Ennis goes to the ranch of Jacks parents. Mrs. Twist feels an immediate connection with him and tries to mother him with Cherry cake and coffee. She has heard the name Ennis Del Mar often from Jack and in her heart of hearts she knows WHO he is. In order to confirm her thoughts she invites him to go up to Jacks childhood room knowing what Jack had put in the closet twenty years ago. As Ennis comes back down the stairs she sees the contents in his hand and knows there could be only one other person in the world except Jack that would know the importance of it. The look in her eyes and her small gestures as she hands him the sack is simply heartbreaking. You can almost hear that mother's heart shattered by the loss of a child scream out "I loved my boy Jack and I don't know and I don't care why you were so important to him but I know you were and I love you for it." But all she can actually say is that he is welcome back anytime. You can feel her total isolation as she watches him leave knowing she has just lost another piece of her son's life. Roberta Maxwell as Jacks mother is pure perfection.
Do I cry? :'(
Roberta Maxwell as Jacks mother is pure perfection.
I totally agree, she got me on all 7 viewings.
I'm flooding my keyboard now :'( :'( :'(
That was such a fine piece of acting, she was real to me.
I wrote it before, when I come back to this thread, I cry like a river.
Thanks for posting glacier1, amazing post indeed.
I agree now, best scene!
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We all agreed however that we felt more uncomfortable with the sexual acrobatics of Halle Berry in "Monster's Ball" and the straiway scene in "The History of Violence" than the brief tent scenes. And the difference between the first night and the second tells you this is going to be more than drunk sex.
I think that would have been my main consern had I gone with my parents. Akward sitting next to them watching sex scenes, but I guess this is a very good point.
buy the DVD and every five or so years watch it again
hehe
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If you decide to go see this movie you will get the chance to learn about love, loss, hate, fear, prejudice, loyalty and betrayal.The one single most important lesson is that we all have to make choices in this life. This has to be done with the most honest and truthful heart possible because no one is an island and your choices do and will affect other people.
If you loved it, or if you liked it, or if you thought it was just OK buy the DVD and every five or so years watch it again because the older the eyes the finer the film.
Well worth the money even without the Senior Discount.
Thankx for posting, great review!
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I just found this story about Roberta Maxwell, the actress portraying Jack's mother. The page also contains a link to an audio interview with her. It's a must for obsessive fans. Among other things is her reading of a complementary letter from Annie Proulx and comments about Heath Ledger's courteous and unexpected return to facilitate shooting of reaction shots (when he wasn't really required to be there) with her and the actor who portrayed Jack's father.
The interview is appropriately called "Depth of Feeling".
http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/archives/2006/01/depth_of_feelin.php
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I just found this story about Roberta Maxwell, the actress portraying Jack's mother. The page also contains a link to an audio interview with her. It's a must for obsessive fans. Among other things is her reading of a complementary letter from Annie Proulx and comments about Heath Ledger's courteous and unexpected return to facilitate shooting of reaction shots (when he wasn't really required to be there) with her and the actor who portrayed Jack's father.
The interview is appropriately called "Depth of Feeling".
http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/archives/2006/01/depth_of_feelin.php
glacier1, you got me again. You must know Jack's mother has a special place in my heart.
Yes, I cry, again!
Thanks for sharing, very much appreciated.
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She probably didn't and i'm probably reading way too much into it, but there is a bit of me that thinks his mom knew that ennis loved Jack. I don't really have an valid points other than...to me, Ennis wanting to take Jacks shirt seems weird IF they were only friends. I think of what it would be like if my brothers friend died, and he went to his house and asked his mom if he could take a simple denim shirt home to remember him. Or even if my friend died ( heaven forbid), and i asked her mom if I could take a top of hers. It is very much a thing someone would do if they were in love with that person. An item of clothing is a very personal thing, and is somthing that can hold so many memories, which is very true in both Ennis and Jacks case. Even if they were best BEST friends, it still seems..odd? It could just be me though :-X
It was also the way his mom was looking at Ennis, and asked him to visit again.
Ok yes..I really am reading too much into this. I apologise lol. Is a nice thought though, that his mom knew of it, and was happy to see Ennis, and to invite him back.
Lea x
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leanne - I agree, she SO knew. I think she could empathise and understand the relationship between Ennis and Jack having lived a life so without happiness. Such a brilliant performance by the two actors playing Jack's mum and dad. Just a few minutes of screen time and you UNDERSTAND everything about Jacks life.
Jack's mum's performance i found particularly touching, just the way she looks at Ennis and touches his shoulder, all the unspoken words that pass between them - really poignant. She knew this was the love of her son's life and tried to offer him a little comfort - 'come and see us again', letting him up to see Jack's room so readily, i don't think these are things someone would do for a perfect stranger. Really REALLY heartbreaking...sob! :'( :'(
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ooooh, thank you for replying! I thought I was the only one that thought it!
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I feel that she did.
There was a wonderful post (sorry I cannot remember the author or thread right now) that dealt with this. What I remember most from this post is that it call to our attention the following: when Ennis returns with the shirts, she seems matter-of-fact about it -- as if she was expecting him to find the things SHE was leading him to find... Another point: how could she not have known that the shirts were there after 20 years?
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God yeah, thats true. Hadn't thought about her knowing about the shirts. :'(
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She probably didn't and i'm probably reading way too much into it, but there is a bit of me that thinks his mom knew that ennis loved Jack.
I don't know if she knew Ennis loved Jack but she sure did know Jack loved Ennis.
Jack put those shirts in his closet when he was just 19 years old. Jack's mother must have been the one to dust his room while he was away. I am sure Jack told her to never touch those shirts or I am sure she would have washed them for him.
Jack seemed to be able to talk openly (at least to a degree) with both his parents. He told them both he and Ennis would move up there and build a cabin together. They MUST have known what that meant. Otherwise, even if Ennis came up there and the two were just friends why wouldn't Jack have just stayed in his own room. And because Jack was open with his parents, I just have a feeling he was more open with his mother. I am sure she knew everything. The way she treated Ennis reinforced that belief in me. I was waiting for her to call him son, as in son-in-law. And the way she put her hand on his shoulder was so telling. There was no real need for her to touch him at that point. There was a "connection" between them. And when she asked Ennis to came back and visit I heard her saying, because I love the person that made my son so happy.
Yup, she knew everything, I am convinced.
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I feel that she did.
There was a wonderful post (sorry I cannot remember the author or thread right now) that dealt with this. What I remember most from this post is that it call to our attention the following: when Ennis returns with the shirts, she seems matter-of-fact about it -- as if she was expecting him to find the things SHE was leading him to find... Another point: how could she not have known that the shirts were there after 20 years?
I always thought she knew or if she really didn't know for sure, she surely suspected and when Ennis showed up, she got her confirmation. I always thought she was leading him to find the shirts, especially since she let him - a perfect stranger to her - go up there alone. She knew what he would find and wanted to give him the time and space to discover and deal with it on his own.
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Who knows you better than your mother? You were created inside of her body. Mothers always know, on some level at least.....
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I feel that she did.
There was a wonderful post (sorry I cannot remember the author or thread right now) that dealt with this.
tpe was this the post you were thinking of?
http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=2216.0#msg36851
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I feel that she did.
There was a wonderful post (sorry I cannot remember the author or thread right now) that dealt with this.
tpe was this the post you were thinking of?
http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=2216.0#msg36851
Yes Patriot1. This is indeed the one. I congratulate you on that wonderful post. I love it.
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Yes Patriot1. This is indeed the one. I congratulate you on that wonderful post. I love it.
Thanks dear. I was just taking the words from my heart.
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I found this priceless Yahoo review on another BBM board and felt most here would enjoy it. (relevant to this thread because of the 5th paragraph) It's one of the most beautiful reflections on the film I've yet read.
The Older The Eyes............The Finer The Film
by txgrandpa65 Jan 10, 2006
My wife and I and our best friends all live in a small town in East Texas. Even though none of us will ever see 65 again we do love to see good movies and we depend on your reviews to help us make our choices. Most of the reviews talked about the visuals and the acting. The one common theme was that you can not leave this movie at the theater it follows you home and that intrigued us.
Last week we drove the two hours to Dallas to see the film. Our first moment of enjoyment was the look on the face of the ticket lady when we asked if the Senior Discount applied to Brokeback. As the movie begins you hear the mournful sound of the train whistle and you sense you are about to go on an amazing journey. And amazing it is. The visuals and the music take you quickly to a place of great beauty, peace, and solitude. The acting is first rate and you swear you actually know Alma, Ennis, Lureen, and Jack just seconds after they appear on the screen. Suffice to say we all four thought the movie was extremely well done and thought provoking.
We would like to give some observations fron the Senior viewpoint. First of all the sexual content of the movie. We were aware of the storyline and somewhat prepared and determined to sit through what ever it was. We all agreed however that we felt more uncomfortable with the sexual acrobatics of Halle Berry in "Monster's Ball" and the straiway scene in "The History of Violence" than the brief tent scenes. And the difference between the first night and the second tells you this is going to be more than drunk sex.
The obvious storyline is about Ennis and Jack but if you can step back and observe and absorb the whole story you will find so many wonderful stories within this story. One real gem is Lureen who proves Texas women don't get older just blonder. Her phone scene with Ennis is just amazing. She is forced to acknowledge that the voice on the other end of the line belongs to the person that owned the piece of her husbands heart that would never be hers. In a split second she has to decide to treat him with contempt or kindness. Anne Hathaway within these few minutes on the screen shows how really talented she is.
In our opinion one of the best parts in the entire movie occur when Ennis goes to the ranch of Jacks parents. Mrs. Twist feels an immediate connection with him and tries to mother him with Cherry cake and coffee. She has heard the name Ennis Del Mar often from Jack and in her heart of hearts she knows WHO he is. In order to confirm her thoughts she invites him to go up to Jacks childhood room knowing what Jack had put in the closet twenty years ago. As Ennis comes back down the stairs she sees the contents in his hand and knows there could be only one other person in the world except Jack that would know the importance of it. The look in her eyes and her small gestures as she hands him the sack is simply heartbreaking. You can almost hear that mother's heart shattered by the loss of a child scream out "I loved my boy Jack and I don't know and I don't care why you were so important to him but I know you were and I love you for it." But all she can actually say is that he is welcome back anytime. You can feel her total isolation as she watches him leave knowing she has just lost another piece of her son's life. Roberta Maxwell as Jacks mother is pure perfection.
If you decide to go see this movie you will get the chance to learn about love, loss, hate, fear, prejudice, loyalty and betrayal.The one single most important lesson is that we all have to make choices in this life. This has to be done with the most honest and truthful heart possible because no one is an island and your choices do and will affect other people.
If you loved it, or if you liked it, or if you thought it was just OK buy the DVD and every five or so years watch it again because the older the eyes the finer the film.
Well worth the money even without the Senior Discount.
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Great review!
Thanks for posting it.
monicita
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Let me put down here a few things.... not only those reated to Jack's parents.
I saw the movie yesterday evening for the first time here in austria, and it is a very moving one due to the story as well as the superb job done by Ang Lee. The play of the main characters should get the highest credit, since it is quite the opposite of what american actors normally deliver. It is a very decent and subtile way of play whereas the average cast normally tend to exaggerate via grimasses.
As to the SOB father, I can very well imagine that he also knew like mom about Jack's love of his life. As a bastard, he might have invented the story that jack wanted to settle down there with another guy in order to hurt Ennis, since he strongly dislikes gay men in general....This is my version, and it can be right as well, I guess.
For sure, Jack was not an angel and had sex with other men (hustlers in Tijuana, neighbours), but as to his character painted on screen and in the novel, I can very well imagine that these episodes where only to get sexual relief because of his higher sex drive (compared with Ennis'), but never intended to put their relationship at risk.
Would like to hear your ideas on that, guyz
Cheers
Kurt
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Hi Kurt,
it gives me special pleasure to welcome you to our forum because we haven't had many German speakers here yet (hopefully, that is going to change, now the movie is out in all German speaking countries). I'm from Berlin, myself... Did you already check in with the "introducing yourself" thread? And maybe you could put yourself on the frapper map (see above). And feel free to put in more reviews in German under "German reviews"! Otherwise, just browse and enjoy!
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After having seen the film over 10 times now, (oh boy! tomorrow I will go and watch it on a HUGE IMAX screen!), I can say that I have never doubted in the least that Jake's mother knew...
From the very first viewing of this wonderful movie, it was plain-as-day for me to see that she knew... This is what made that last scene of Ennis' visit to Jack's parents so poignant and utterly heart-wrenching.
Her eyes reveal that she knew...her miniscule gestures and the trace of tears in her clear, open eyes show us that she knows what Ennis meant to her son Jack...and regardless of what her husband says...she was accepting of it, and ok with it...because she loved her son Jack so much...
But, sadly she is caught up in a relationship where the man rules the house...the man speaks...while the wife stays dutifully silent...
Though using what little she has, she makes her (personal) standpoint clear to Ennis...
The coffee and cherry cake offering, saying that she had purposely kept Jack's room exactly as it was when he was little, saying to Ennis that he is welcome to go up to the room, the gentle hand on his shoulder, the knowing look in her eyes while she hurries to get Ennis a paper sack for the two shirts when he comes down from Jack's room (he doesn't have to say a word...she knows exactly what they mean to him!), turning her back towards her husband in a steadfast and almost belligerent stance while looking directly up to Ennis' face and asking him in a steady and controlled manner, to come visit them again...
And most of all, in the doorway, as Ennis takes his leave...out of direct eyesight of her dominant husband..."in private with Ennis"...she accepts Ennis' whispered "much obliged ma'am" ...with a sad look which makes clear to the audience, and to Ennis also, that she knew...
A tender moment which lasts but a second, but which is laden with so much emotion, that it would make even the most stoic amongst us choke back a quiet sob...
sam
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As to the SOB father, I can very well imagine that he also knew like mom about Jack's love of his life. As a bastard, he might have invented the story that jack wanted to settle down there with another guy in order to hurt Ennis, since he strongly dislikes gay men in general....This is my version, and it can be right as well, I guess.
Would like to hear your ideas on that, guyz
Kurt
Hi Kurt,
I think I am the only one that feels differently about the father. Oh sure, he was an SOB, even Jack said there was no pleasing his old man. But, while Ennis was there and the father was complaining, I felt the father was more pissed off because Jack never did bring Ennis or Randall to the ranch to help out.
This is what the screenplay says:
John Twist: (angrily)
Jack used a say, 'Ennis del Mar,' he used a say, 'I'm goin' a bring him up here one a these days and we'll lick this damn ranch into shape.' He had some half-baked notion the two a you was goin' a move up here, build a cabin, help run the place.
(pause)
Then this spring he's got another fella's goin' a come up here with him and build a place and help run the ranch, some ranch neighbor a his from down in Texas. He's goin' a split up with his wife and come back here.
(sarcastic)
So he says. But like most a Jack's ideas it never come to pass.[/i]
In the screenplay, the last five words are the most important, I believe. "...it never come to pass."...said in a sarcastic tone. The old man was pissed because jack never kept his promises to bring Ennis (or Randall) back home to help his dad out.
Now, Annie makes this even clearer in her story. I won't quote the whole paragraph because it is basically the same as the screenplay. But, the first two sentences are not in the screenplay. These two sentences make it very clear why the old man is pissed.
The old man spoke angrily. "I can't get no help out here. Jack use to say, 'Ennis del Mar,' he use to say.....
[emphasis was added to point out key passage]
So, that is why I believe the father was more pissed that Jack and Ennis didn't come and help with the ranch than he was pissed that Jack was in love with Ennis. Don't get me wrong, I don't think the father was likely to throw a 25th anniversary party for Jack and Ennis, but that wasn't why he was angry.
Just my perspective brothers, sisters and friends. I am sure you have your own.
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I agree with you patrior1, but I think Jacks dad knew Ennis was special. He obviously knew who Ennis was and not the "other fella" He might not have known to the extent mum knew but he knew Ennis ment something to Jack. Either he hadn't bother to remember the "other fellas" name or Ennis had been mentioned so much he remembered.
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I agree with you patrior1, but I think Jacks dad knew Ennis was special. He obviously knew who Ennis was and not the "other fella" He might not have known to the extent mum knew but he knew Ennis ment something to Jack. Either he hadn't bother to remember the "other fellas" name or Ennis had been mentioned so much he remembered.
I had to go back and reread my post to see why you might have thought I didn't think the father knew Jack was "special." I can see I didn't actually come out and say it I just implied it. Sorry. Yes, Jack's father knew he was gay but he was more angry that Jack never brought the help he said he would.
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I had to go back and reread my post to see why you might have thought I didn't think the father knew Jack was "special." I can see I didn't actually come out and say it I just implied it. Sorry. Yes, Jack's father knew he was gay but he was more angry that Jack never brought the help he said he would.
I agree with you. That's what I thought the first time I saw BBM (in french). His father was more upset by the fact that Jack always told them about Ennis, and that they would come and help the father. But nothing he said never happend... I think Jack must have already made promises that he didn't keep before.
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Knowing what kinda father grumpy old twist was, from novel mostly, I don't think Jack woulda brought anyone up there untill he was sure thay would stay... he needed someone to back him up agains daddy dearest ( thinking of joan crawford here ). Not just because of what daddy was but also someone tht would back him uo about beeing gay, cause if daddy didn't know for sure beofer he woulda got the gist at some point.
And I'm sure I just blinked and missed what you ment patriot1 :)
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Let me put down here a few things.... not only those reated to Jack's parents.
I saw the movie yesterday evening for the first time here in austria, and it is a very moving one due to the story as well as the superb job done by Ang Lee. The play of the main characters should get the highest credit, since it is quite the opposite of what american actors normally deliver. It is a very decent and subtile way of play whereas the average cast normally tend to exaggerate via grimasses.
As to the SOB father, I can very well imagine that he also knew like mom about Jack's love of his life. As a bastard, he might have invented the story that jack wanted to settle down there with another guy in order to hurt Ennis, since he strongly dislikes gay men in general....This is my version, and it can be right as well, I guess.
For sure, Jack was not an angel and had sex with other men (hustlers in Tijuana, neighbours), but as to his character painted on screen and in the novel, I can very well imagine that these episodes where only to get sexual relief because of his higher sex drive (compared with Ennis'), but never intended to put their relationship at risk.
Would like to hear your ideas on that, guyz
Cheers
Kurt
I really think he had heard Jack talk about Ennis so much, and there dream move back to the farm to fix it up, he never thought he would ever meet him. I am sure that stud duck knew that Ennis was the love of Jack's life, and held him in the highest contempt. I'm not so sure it was made up to hurt him. I think it was said to let Ennis know where he stood with him.
The subltle interplay in this movie between all the characters is what makes Brokeback Mouintain so good. Add the excellant direction by Ang Lee and breathtaking cinematography, and you do indeed have one of the greatest movies of all time.
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I just got into this thread today. Roberta Maxwell is truly and amazing actress. Her performance just knocked my sox off, so understated and yet so deep and important to moving the movie forward. Did Jack's mom know? Of course she did. She "kept the room like it was when he was a boy." Surely she knew of the existence of the shirts. As was said above, "A mother always knows." Despite her own beaten down world she was happy that Jack had had what he did with Ennis. She led him to the shirts.
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Roberta rocks, Annie Proulx wrote her a note that said it best, to the effect that in a few looks and gestures she
let us know that Jack's Mom knew how much Ennis cared for Jack.
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Thanks, Toadily
One of the best plums I got from my most recent viewing of the film was watching Jack's mother very carefully, and yes, with the same kind of subtlety that suffuses the rest of the movie, she makes it very clear that she understands the significance of the shirts to Ennis, and thus her understanding of Jack and Ennis's love for each other. Her-Roberta Maxwell's-performance is as sweet as any other in the film.
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Roberta rocks, Annie Proulx wrote her a note that said it best, to the effect that in a few looks and gestures she
let us know that Jack's Mom knew how much Ennis cared for Jack.
Yes Roberta Maxwell is perfect.... It's amazing how the casting of BBM is so good...
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BBM HAS THE BEST ENSEMBLE CAST. PERIOD.
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tpe,
BBM HAS THE BEST ENSEMBLE CAST. PERIOD.
Amen, brother!!
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I'd like to send Roberta a letter. Anyone know where I might do that? My one contact in the theater world of NYC is not responding to my emails and I fear the worst for her.
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tpe,
BBM HAS THE BEST ENSEMBLE CAST. PERIOD.
Amen, brother!!
DITTO!
proulxfan you cannot be more right
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I'd like to send Roberta a letter. Anyone know where I might do that? My one contact in the theater world of NYC is not responding to my emails and I fear the worst for her.
You can mail it to Focus Features.
Roberta Maxwell
c/o Focus Features
100 Universal City Plaza
Universal City, CA 91608
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Thanks Ethan. You are such a well of knowledge! :)
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Wow - this is a great website...with a special section just about Jack's mother...whoever directed me to this site...thank you. This tender scene....Ennis coming down the stairs with the shirt in his hands remains one of the most powerful to me. It combines the love of Jack from both Ennis and his mom...as the reconnect putting the shirt in the paperbag together I am struck by their shared love...its almost as if they are having their own ritual of honor to Jack as they pack away his shirt. They are that connected in their shared love.
I think we see, in this scnee, that Jack found his love from his Mom...and in looking back on some of the tenderness that Jack showed for Ennis (remember the scene where he tries to clean Ennis' wounds with a damp hankerchief?) comes from his Mom. Yeah, his Dad was a nasty old man...but he has his Mom.
Jim
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I think we see, in this scnee, that Jack found his love from his Mom...and in looking back on some of the tenderness that Jack showed for Ennis (remember the scene where he tries to clean Ennis' wounds with a damp hankerchief?) comes from his Mom. Yeah, his Dad was a nasty old man...but he has his Mom.
Jim
Wow. That is something I don't remember seeing anyone writing about. It never occurred to me that Jack was trying to tend to Ennis's wound like his mother would tend to his. But now that you mention it he probably did get that compassion from her.
Great observation.
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I think we see, in this scnee, that Jack found his love from his Mom...and in looking back on some of the tenderness that Jack showed for Ennis (remember the scene where he tries to clean Ennis' wounds with a damp hankerchief?) comes from his Mom. Yeah, his Dad was a nasty old man...but he has his Mom.
Jim
Wow. That is something I don't remember seeing anyone writing about. It never occurred to me that Jack was trying to tend to Ennis's wound like his mother would tend to his. But now that you mention it he probably did get that compassion from her.
Great observation.
Oh yes, great obervation. Thanks for sharing Jim. By the way this scene kills me each time I see it, just the eyes of Ennis and Jack's mum I not even mentioning the shirts. Here I go again, each time I come to this thread I cannot help it but cry.
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Wow - this is a great website...with a special section just about Jack's mother...whoever directed me to this site...thank you. This tender scene....Ennis coming down the stairs with the shirt in his hands remains one of the most powerful to me. It combines the love of Jack from both Ennis and his mom...as the reconnect putting the shirt in the paperbag together I am struck by their shared love...its almost as if they are having their own ritual of honor to Jack as they pack away his shirt. They are that connected in their shared love.
I think we see, in this scene, that Jack found his love from his Mom...and in looking back on some of the tenderness that Jack showed for Ennis (remember the scene where he tries to clean Ennis' wounds with a damp hankerchief?) comes from his Mom. Yeah, his Dad was a nasty old man...but he has his Mom.
Jim
Your comments make me understand what an underappreciated scene this really is. I've seen the movie 9 times and always knew there was something about it. Thanks Jim for sheding some light on it.
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The deeper I feel the movie the more the universal love comes up...Jack's mom, Jack trying to tend to Ennis' wound, Alma Jr. tender scene inviting her Dad to her wedding, Ennis' barroom girlfriend trying to get him to understand her love for him...they all fill this open heart with strong message. Just to love - just to love.
It inspires me to live a better life.
Jim
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Wow - this is a great website...with a special section just about Jack's mother...whoever directed me to this site...thank you. This tender scene....Ennis coming down the stairs with the shirt in his hands remains one of the most powerful to me. It combines the love of Jack from both Ennis and his mom...as the reconnect putting the shirt in the paperbag together I am struck by their shared love...its almost as if they are having their own ritual of honor to Jack as they pack away his shirt. They are that connected in their shared love.
I think we see, in this scnee, that Jack found his love from his Mom...and in looking back on some of the tenderness that Jack showed for Ennis (remember the scene where he tries to clean Ennis' wounds with a damp hankerchief?) comes from his Mom. Yeah, his Dad was a nasty old man...but he has his Mom.
Jim
Wow! Another new perspective to that particular scene! Thanks for sharing sjmf! I will get in line behind the others giving thanks for your thoughts. Very, very good observation. I'm glad to embrace that thought in my heart too. (sam wipes a tear away from his cheek)
The deeper I feel the movie the more the universal love comes up...Jack's mom, Jack trying to tend to Ennis' wound, Alma Jr. tender scene inviting her Dad to her wedding, Ennis' barroom girlfriend trying to get him to understand her love for him...they all fill this open heart with strong message. Just to love - just to love.
It inspires me to live a better life.
(sam really crying now...) Yes Jim, let's hope that this marvelous film helps to make the world just that little bit better...and that it will teach us simply to love...
sam
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The deeper I feel the movie the more the universal love comes up...Jack's mom, Jack trying to tend to Ennis' wound, Alma Jr. tender scene inviting her Dad to her wedding, Ennis' barroom girlfriend trying to get him to understand her love for him...they all fill this open heart with strong message. Just to love - just to love.
It inspires me to live a better life.
Jim
You said it, Jim. A better life, more love.
I think she knew about Jack. I also imagine that is why she said that Ennis could come back any time. She must have known that if Jack spoke about Ennis for nearly 20 years, they were bound together like she was to her husband. :'(
A 75-year-old lady I know actually enjoyed the film, but I didn't ask why. I hope that for mothers and grandmothers everywhere wo see the film, something of the mother of Jack can inspire them too (if they need the inspiration). Stephan
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Jack's mother is a tender character. I think she knows about Jack and she knows about Ennis to. Even she didn't speak to much her eyes are so expressive and when she leaves Ennis it seems to me that she communicate so many comprehension and solidarity to him. She maybe the second person, after Ennis, who loved Jack... they have a secret tie!
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Jack's mother is a tender character. I think she knows about Jack and she knows about Ennis to. Even she didn't speak to much her eyes are so expressive and when she leaves Ennis it seems to me that she communicate so many comprehension and solidarity to him. She maybe the second person, after Ennis, who loved Jack... they have a secret tie!
Go listen to the Roberta Maxwell interview
http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=279.0
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It's the best interview. I love how Proulx contacted her.
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Wow! I just listened to the interview. What a wonderful lady, helped me to understand how a movie is shot and how they were all so into it. She spoke exactly 5 lines of dialog but conveyed volumes with her eyes and body. Now that is SOME acting my friends.
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Wow! I just listened to the interview. What a wonderful lady, helped me to understand how a movie is shot and how they were all so into it. She spoke exactly 5 lines of dialog but conveyed volumes with her eyes and body. Now that is SOME acting my friends.
IMO besides Heath and Jake, she gives the best acting of the movie.
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Go listen to the Roberta Maxwell interview
http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=279.0
WOW! I just found the interview thanks to you. I know she was talking about her part and what she was suppose to convey in the movie, but when she said she loved her son and here was the boy that loved her son, for a minute I forgot she was talking about her part. I felt she was talking about a real life situation. What a wonderful woman.
I was also surprised to hear her say they had experienced some hostility in Alberta because of the subject matter. Doesn't offer much hope for the immediate future.
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IMO besides Heath and Jake, she gives the best acting of the movie.
I agree totally Chameau. She should have been given the Best Actress in a Supporting Role nomination.
I love her to pieces.
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Wow! I just listened to the interview. What a wonderful lady, helped me to understand how a movie is shot and how they were all so into it. She spoke exactly 5 lines of dialog but conveyed volumes with her eyes and body. Now that is SOME acting my friends.
IMO besides Heath and Jake, she gives the best acting of the movie.
Yep I think so too...<OT> but now I also love Anne's Lureen too! For such a young actress, that last scene on the phone, she was fantastic x
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IMO besides Heath and Jake, she gives the best acting of the movie.
I agree totally Chameau. She should have been given the Best Actress in a Supporting Role nomination.
I love her to pieces.
It's my best scene of the movie, hard to look at because too much emotions from Ennis and Jack's mum I could take, I'm not mentioning the shirts. Most of the shots are close ups, the actors were good enough to live their characters with a camera almost under their noses.
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The deeper I feel the movie the more the universal love comes up...Jack's mom, Jack trying to tend to Ennis' wound, Alma Jr. tender scene inviting her Dad to her wedding, Ennis' barroom girlfriend trying to get him to understand her love for him...they all fill this open heart with strong message. Just to love - just to love.
It inspires me to live a better life.
Jim
Jim , I think most of us feel that as well. Love is the overlying theme of this film. Like you after watching it I felt it was time to live a better and more fulfilling life. We all lose sight of what is most important these days, it's not the house or the car it's to be loved in this world and to love right back.
I register deaths up to 10 times ad ay at work and the stories that partners and children tell, let you know how much these people were loved and how much they will be missed....you never hear people tell you of the material possessions the person had but more of the times they made them laugh and feel happy and loved and wanted.
Even Jesus said it when he said " Above all else, Loe one another"
I am sometimes flippant and cheeky on these boards but I know it was BBM that brought me here to discover this for myself.
Thanks Jim for a lovely post.
Tom
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WOW! I just found the interview thanks to you. I know she was talking about her part and what she was suppose to convey in the movie, but when she said she loved her son and here was the boy that loved her son, for a minute I forgot she was talking about her part. I felt she was talking about a real life situation. What a wonderful woman.
When I heard her say that I nearly fell out of my chair. She had gone back into character so completely. The scene is remarkable in that it is all closeups save for the beginning shot a tableau of the 3 people, Ennis, Jack's mother and his father. It's an establishing shot and then goes closeup of each actor. Tonight I am stuned at the power of 5 lines by Roberta, 8 brief lines by Heath and 10 by Peter. When I first read the screenplay I thought to myself, gee, I could write this.....so few words. But now I understand. This film is not about words, it's about feelings and expressing them. I'm really gasping for breath here. This movie just doesn't stop getting me!
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Thank you Frog123 for sending us to the interview. I know I sound like a broken record but this website has meant so much to me. To be able to hear this interview and know deeply what shooting that scene was like brings me joy. I helps me see that we DID notice something amazing happening in that scene.. and we have a right to our intense feelings that do not die even months after seeing the film. Thanks...
More thoughts on Jack's Mom - I imagine in that she was very grateful for that short time Ennis visited. How lonely her life must have been. I have had the opportunity to read Annie Proulx's short storiy collection, Close Range, which includes BBM. From that excellent collection I got a full dose of what life in Wyoming is like...and I imagine Jack's mom having one of those lives. To have Ennis, the love of her son's life, come through those doors. Remember the scene where he pulls in their homestead and she comes out the door. Notice her face and body in this scene. You can see adoration in her eyes...almost a sense of peace having met him in the flesh. I am sure she kept that brief moment in time in her heart: the place where no evil or hatred can touch.
Jim
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Remember the scene where he pulls in their homestead and she comes out the door. Notice her face and body in this scene. You can see adoration in her eyes...almost a sense of peace having met him in the flesh. I am sure she kept that brief moment in time in her heart: the place where no evil or hatred can touch.
Jim
It is such a coincidence you should mention when she came to the door.
Ennis pulls up and parks, she comes to the door. Ennis gets out of the truck, she can see it is a man. Now they live out in the middle of nowhere so I am thinking they don't get too many visitors out there so she knew who it was. She then comes out of the house, stands up straight and fixes her sweater as if to honor him by coming out to greet him. This is something people do who have manners and honor their guest, others you stay at the door and wait for them to get there.
I have always counted the twist house scene among my favorites but after listening to her interview, it means just a little more.
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Remember the scene where he pulls in their homestead and she comes out the door. Notice her face and body in this scene. You can see adoration in her eyes...almost a sense of peace having met him in the flesh. I am sure she kept that brief moment in time in her heart: the place where no evil or hatred can touch.
Jim
It is such a coincidence you should mention when she came to the door.
Ennis pulls up and parks, she comes to the door. Ennis gets out of the truck, she can see it is a man. Now they live out in the middle of nowhere so I am thinking they don't get too many visitors out there so she knew who it was. She then comes out of the house, stands up straight and fixes her sweater as if to honor him by coming out to greet him. This is something people do who have manners and honor their guest, others you stay at the door and wait for them to get there.
I have always counted the twist house scene among my favorites but after listening to her interview, it means just a little more.
It has come to mean a lot more for me since reading this thread. Thanks to all who have posted.
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Remember the scene where he pulls in their homestead and she comes out the door. Notice her face and body in this scene. You can see adoration in her eyes...almost a sense of peace having met him in the flesh. I am sure she kept that brief moment in time in her heart: the place where no evil or hatred can touch.
Jim
It is such a coincidence you should mention when she came to the door.
Ennis pulls up and parks, she comes to the door. Ennis gets out of the truck, she can see it is a man. Now they live out in the middle of nowhere so I am thinking they don't get too many visitors out there so she knew who it was. She then comes out of the house, stands up straight and fixes her sweater as if to honor him by coming out to greet him. This is something people do who have manners and honor their guest, others you stay at the door and wait for them to get there.
I have always counted the twist house scene among my favorites but after listening to her interview, it means just a little more.
It has come to mean a lot more for me since reading this thread. Thanks to all who have posted.
Yes thank you for posting such a great observation. Jack's mum was fantastic...Roberta Maxwell simply amazing!
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I have just listnend to the Roberta Maxwell interview and I think it is safe to put this question to rest with a loud and clear YES...Ms Maxwell sayd it, sayd Ang Lee sayd it and the letter she got from Annie Proulx sayd it... Jack's mother knew
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I have just listnend to the Roberta Maxwell interview and I think it is safe to put this question to rest with a loud and clear YES...Ms Maxwell sayd it, sayd Ang Lee sayd it and the letter she got from Annie Proulx sayd it... Jack's mother knew
yep!
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Can I ask you guy, when Ennis says Ok to Jack's Dad after he says "Tell you what, we have a family plot, he's goin in it" is it played with sort of understated anger? I felt it was. So I guess that is what matters, but you can tell ENnis knows damn quick this guys an ass, and hates him for not letting him take Jack's ashes up there where JACK WANTED THEM.
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Can I ask you guy, when Ennis says Ok to Jack's Dad after he says "Tell you what, we have a family plot, he's goin in it" is it played with sort of understated anger? I felt it was. So I guess that is what matters, but you can tell ENnis knows damn quick this guys an ass, and hates him for not letting him take Jack's ashes up there where JACK WANTED THEM.
like froggy sayd...Yep
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Can I ask you guy, when Ennis says Ok to Jack's Dad after he says "Tell you what, we have a family plot, he's goin in it" is it played with sort of understated anger? I felt it was. So I guess that is what matters, but you can tell ENnis knows damn quick this guys an ass, and hates him for not letting him take Jack's ashes up there where JACK WANTED THEM.
There was definately anger in his voice. Both of Jack's parent's knew exactly who Ennis was, and his father was not happy about it.
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Can I ask you guy, when Ennis says Ok to Jack's Dad after he says "Tell you what, we have a family plot, he's goin in it" is it played with sort of understated anger? I felt it was. So I guess that is what matters, but you can tell ENnis knows damn quick this guys an ass, and hates him for not letting him take Jack's ashes up there where JACK WANTED THEM.
like froggy sayd...Yep
Ennis had tears in his eyes at this moment
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This sequence packs a huge emotional wallop. Roberta Maxwell was perfect.
(https://ennisjack.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg90.imageshack.us%2Fimg90%2F4149%2Frobertamaxwell8zb.jpg&hash=85662c19b6b293e151ea0328d1dd3c410174800f)
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WOW! Thank you so much...seeing this again is fantastic.
That very last one...she wants to say something...but she cant!
Thank you for posting these x
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WOW! Thank you so much...seeing this again is fantastic.
That very last one...she wants to say something...but she cant!
Thank you for posting these x
:-\ yes thanks glacier1
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She is indeed perfect. Thanks.
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Wow, seeing Ennis's face after she touches him so lovingly, it's like "bless you".
Sigh.
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Wow, seeing Ennis's face after she touches him so lovingly, it's like "bless you".
Sigh.
and his look says "Thank you"
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yeah.. love that scens :'(
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Froggy, you must know, what is the origin of "half-baked" and what is the generally accepted meaning?
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Froggy, you must know, what is the origin of "half-baked" and what is the generally accepted meaning?
???
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I know biscuit...as in twice cooked...bis (twice) cuit (cook)..doubt that's what u were interested in.....
"half baked"...you've lost me..what do you mean?
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May be of some-help:
From the Online Etymology Dictionary
half
O.E. half, halb (Mercian), healf (W. Saxon) "side, part" (original sense preserved in behalf), from P.Gmc. *khalbas "something divided" (cf. O.N. halfr, O.Fris., M.Du. half, Ger. halb, Goth. halbs "half"). Used also in O.E. phrases as in modern Ger., to mean "one half unit less than," cf. þridda healf "two and a half," lit. "half third." The construction in two and a half, etc., is first recorded c.1200. Of time, in half past ten, etc., first attested 1750; in Scottish, the half often is prefixed to the following hour, as in Ger. (halb elf "ten thirty"). Half-and-half "ale and porter" is from 1756; half-baked in sense of "silly" is from 1855; half-breed "mixed race" is from 1760; half-blooded in this sense is from 1605. Half-brother (c.1330) and half-sister (c.1205) were in M.E.. Halftime in football is from 1871. half-truth is first recorded 1658; half-hearted is from 1611. To go off half-cocked "speak or act too hastily" (1833) is in allusion to firearms.
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Is this a trick question of some sort? ???
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May be of some-help:
...half-baked in sense of "silly" is from 1855;...
Thanks tpe. So I guess Jack's father just thought it was a "silly" idea of Jacks to build a cabin on the ranch and live there with Ennis. Actually, "silly" doesn't sound like a strong negative. "Silly" things happen all the time.
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May be of some-help:
...half-baked in sense of "silly" is from 1855;...
Thanks tpe. So I guess Jack's father just thought it was a "silly" idea of Jacks to build a cabin on the ranch and live there with Ennis. Actually, "silly" doesn't sound like a strong negative. "Silly" things happen all the time.
You're welcome. I found the question rather interesting myself.
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Oh! I didn't know where it orginated, but I knew that half-baked meant exactly what is sounds like it means, half way done. Jack's plans were only half thought through. They were those grand plans that never amount to anything, because you get way too excited about it, before you have all the facts.
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Oh! I didn't know where it orginated, but I knew that half-baked meant exactly what is sounds like it means, half way done. Jack's plans were only half thought through. They were those grand plans that never amount to anything, because you get way too excited about it, before you have all the facts.
I would think this could be an alternative meaning. I will have to check, but some people do use it this way.
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hahahaha...I get it..."half baked"...well we kinda say it in French, it's very discriminating...but it's mainly to describe someone who is believed/or wrongly believed to be a little slow (brain-wise).
Instead of staying in the oven for 9 months..it's only half baked!
Hahahahaahah...I sure am laughing at myself now..then aagin...I do have 38.5 of temperature!
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hahahaha...I get it..."half baked"...well we kinda say it in French, it's very discriminating...but it's mainly to describe someone who is believed/or wrongly believed to be a little slow (brain-wise).
Instead of staying in the oven for 9 months..it's only half baked!
Hahahahaahah...I sure am laughing at myself now..then aagin...I do have 38.5 of temperature!
How interesting. Thanks, Froggy, for the insight.
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WOW! Thank you so much...seeing this again is fantastic.
That very last one...she wants to say something...but she cant!
Thank you for posting these x
Yes thanks, I saved it immediately. Great series of pictures.
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Glacier 1, what a perfect response. I wish some of the senior citizens in my life felt more like you and your friends. I love everything you said, and after seeing the movie for the 6th time tonight, your writing dried out my tear ducts all over again! Thank you! :-*
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Some additional insights on this scene after having watched the DVD: I just noticed that Jack's mom almost interrupts her husband's speech about Jack bringing the ranch neighbor up from Texas, when she tells Ennis to have a look in Jack's room. I had felt for some time that she knew about the shirts, and meant for Ennis to find them, but I had assumed that this was just to comfort Ennis. She could see and feel his grief about Jack's death, but now I think she may have intended it additionally as a way to thwart the damage inflicted on Ennis by this revelation of Jack's "infidelity", as if she were saying, "Go on upstairs and find out how much and how long Jack loved you. The rancher doesn't' really matter."
Larry McMurtry has said that this is the scene that makes BBM a great film, and I agree, because it deftly and subtly portrays the two unchanging truths of tragedy: Love = Loss, and Life = Death. In both cases, you can't have one without experiencing the other. I believe this is what makes the film and story have universal meaning, and why it has hit so many of its fans in such a profound way. Many have said it is like grieving, and it certainly has been that way for me at times.
BTW, I also agree with the assessment that Ms. Maxwell's performance was on the highest level and on a par with Heath's and Jake's.
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BTW, I also agree with the assessment that Ms. Maxwell's performance was on the highest level and on a par with Heath's and Jake's.
Isn't it amazing how the three of them said more to the viewers with their eyes, facial expressions and body language than all the words in the movie. I can not see how I could possibly see acting on this par ever again.
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Some additional insights on this scene after having watched the DVD: I just noticed that Jack's mom almost interrupts her husband's speech about Jack bringing the ranch neighbor up from Texas, when she tells Ennis to have a look in Jack's room. I had felt for some time that she knew about the shirts, and meant for Ennis to find them, but I had assumed that this was just to comfort Ennis. She could see and feel his grief about Jack's death, but now I think she may have intended it additionally as a way to thwart the damage inflicted on Ennis by this revelation of Jack's "infidelity", as if she were saying, "Go on upstairs and find out how much and how long Jack loved you. The rancher doesn't really matter."
That's an exquisite nuance, proulxfan, and I believe it true. If I didn't believe it true, my eyes would be dry right now.
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BTW, I also agree with the assessment that Ms. Maxwell's performance was on the highest level and on a par with Heath's and Jake's.
Isn't it amazing how the three of them said more to the viewers with their eyes, facial expressions and body language than all the words in the movie. I can not see how I could possibly see acting on this par ever again.
Indeed, I remember Gyllenhaal saying to Jay Leno-or someone-that what isn't said [in words] in this film is more significant than what is, and the more times I see it, the truer that statement rings.
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BTW, I also agree with the assessment that Ms. Maxwell's performance was on the highest level and on a par with Heath's and Jake's.
Isn't it amazing how the three of them said more to the viewers with their eyes, facial expressions and body language than all the words in the movie. I can not see how I could possibly see acting on this par ever again.
I read that the scene with Heath and the Twists was shot in a single day. It's pure and simply breathtaking genius.
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Jerbear,
Just noticed your signature. Beautiful, man. What a great image!! Thanks.
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I think both of Jack's parents knew about Jack, his saying he would come up there with Ennis "Jack used to say" his dad said...not Jack said...making it clear that he talked often about Ennis, not just mentioning him once. Ennis had a little smile on his lips when he said that, which faded when the other rancher was mentioned. Ennis got tears in his eyes and his chin looked like it quivered a little. I think what he said about the other rancher was just a dig at Ennis...though it was probably true. After he said that, Jack's mom immediately put her hand on Ennis' shoulder, like she was trying to comfort him...the only thing she could do with Jack's father right there. So she sent him up to Jack's room, probably knowing what he'd find in the closet.
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Maybe I'm way off base, but I think that, since there was no way in hell Ennis would ever accept an invitation back to the Twist's just to visit--and Jack's mom well knew that--her invitation was to return secretly and take Jack's ashes up to Brokeback the way Jack wanted--and to complete the circle. I further think Ennis' statement at the end after straightening the postcard of BBM, "Jack, I swear..." was a vow somehow to take Jack's ashes back to Brokeback.
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Maybe I'm way off base, but I think that, since there was no way in hell Ennis would ever accept an invitation back to the Twist's just to visit--and Jack's mom well knew that--her invitation was to return secretly and take Jack's ashes up to Brokeback the way Jack wanted--and to complete the circle. I further think Ennis' statement at the end after straightening the postcard of BBM, "Jack, I swear..." was a vow somehow to take Jack's ashes back to Brokeback.
That is a possibility I guess but 2 years passed since he was at the Twist residence. When was he planning on doing it?
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Maybe when mean old Papa Twisy died. I like the idea though
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I love the idea of Ennis returning for Jack's ashes and taking them to Brokeback mountain. Its unlikely, but its possible.
I love the way both the story and the film are full of these intricate possibilities, nothing stated as an absolute certainty. It's a metaphor for Jack and Ennis's relationship: 'Nothing ended, nothing begun, nothing resolved'.
BTW there is just one look on Jack's mother's face which to me suggests that she might be hinting to Ennis that Jack's ashes belong on Brokeback.
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Check out this interview with Roberta Maxwell, the actress who played Jack's mom. Listen to the MP3 of the interview, and how she says "my son..." According to her, Jack's mother knew about Jack and Ennis.
http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/archives/2006/01/depth_of_feelin.php
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thanks for that Johnny Angel.
I thought both Roberta Maxwell and Peter McRobbie were absolutely brilliant as Jack's parents. His father's cruelty is stated more specifically in the story but its there in the film. I think that his parents knew that Jack was gay from a young age - hence his father would not give him advice or go to see him in rodeo. When I first saw the film I even thought his father may have had some part in Jack's death!
Annie Proulx clearly thought that Jack's mother knew how deeply Jack and Ennis were in love, she is compassionate in her words and gestures to Ennis, and there is that one expression (when she slightly raises an eyebrow) when she seems to be saying:
'Take the ashes, I won't see him buried on the grieving plain, Jack belongs on Brokeback Mountain with you! :'(
I do believe Jack knew that Ennis would find the shirts, and I think Jack's mother knew it too, and was hoping he would find them.
She is the only character in the story who would support and celebrate the love between Ennis and Jack - she is the closest to us, as readers or audience.
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you bet
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BTW, I also agree with the assessment that Ms. Maxwell's performance was on the highest level and on a par with Heath's and Jake's.
Isn't it amazing how the three of them said more to the viewers with their eyes, facial expressions and body language than all the words in the movie. I can not see how I could possibly see acting on this par ever again.
I read that the scene with Heath and the Twists was shot in a single day. It's pure and simply breathtaking genius.
It was Heath's last day and he was not even meant to stay there for the whole thing...listen to Roberta's interview and you'll get the info too. http://www.ennisjack.com/index.php?topic=3080.0
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Thanks for that...I listened to the interview, which was really interesting. I can understand now that it was Heath's last day of shooting - he put everything into it!
I remember also that Jack's father knew where Brokeback Mountain is - he knew about Jack and Ennis....
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Maybe I'm way off base, but I think that, since there was no way in hell Ennis would ever accept an invitation back to the Twist's just to visit--and Jack's mom well knew that--her invitation was to return secretly and take Jack's ashes up to Brokeback the way Jack wanted--and to complete the circle. I further think Ennis' statement at the end after straightening the postcard of BBM, "Jack, I swear..." was a vow somehow to take Jack's ashes back to Brokeback.
That is a possibility I guess but 2 years passed since he was at the Twist residence. When was he planning on doing it?
How do you know that its been two years? What did I miss that lets you know that it has been two years? Donna ???
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I don't know where that 2 years time lapse come from, but I wonder why Jack's ashes haven't been interred in the family plot by the time of Ennis's visit? The story suggests it is some months after Jack's death. And why doesn't Jack's father at least let Ennis see and hold the urn, or whatever holds the ashes?
I wonder if the father, knowing that Ennis was Jack's lover, refuses to allow the ashes to go to Brokeback Mountain as some spiteful homophobic retribution? I had not thought of this before, and it makes the story even more heartbreaking!
It does though allow for the possibility that Jack's mother is indeed inviting Ennis to return for the ashes, and that Ennis's 'Jack, I swear' is in part a vow to return him to Brokeback Mountain....maybe to be united with Ennis, in the fullness of time...
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That is a possibility I guess but 2 years passed since he was at the Twist residence. When was he planning on doing it?
How do you know that its been two years? What did I miss that lets you know that it has
been two years? Donna ???
Sorry Donna, I should have said the screenplay says two years has passed. Also, less understandable, Alma tells Ennis it has been two years since she went out with Troy giving the impression that Ennis has been in a mournful fog for two years.
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That is a possibility I guess but 2 years passed since he was at the Twist residence. When was he planning on doing it?
How do you know that its been two years? What did I miss that lets you know that it has
been two years? Donna ???
Sorry Donna, I should have said the screenplay says two years has passed. Also, less understandable, Alma tells Ennis it has been two years since she went out with Troy giving the impression that Ennis has been in a mournful fog for two years.
This is indeed correct. The screenplay puts the visit to Jack's parents in 1982 (probably fall), and Alma Jr.'s visit in 1984 (probably spring).
For a concordance between story and screenplay timelines for the final scenes, check out one insightful post in the thread dealing with the Timelines on the Final Scenes.
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Thanks for the link Johnny Angel. She was amazing and impactful in her role as Jack's mom.
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...but I wonder why Jack's ashes haven't been interred in the family plot by the time of Ennis's visit? The story suggests it is some months after Jack's death.
In some families it is customary to keep the ashes in the home for at least a year for mourning.
Then, the ashes are buried or put into a crypt. That is the way it was in my family so I just assumed that is the way it was in Jack's. Never gave it a second thought.
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Thanks for the link Johnny Angel. She was amazing and impactful in her role as Jack's mom.
I totally agree. Like Annie Proulx wrote in her note to her, "...just the right touch." The scene with Jack's parents is becoming one of my favorite scenes, now that I've got the DVD.
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I think that Jack's mother definitely knew about her son's relationship with Ennis. A mother has an intuition about these things -- especially a good mother. She probably never had a conversation with Jack about it... it was probably more along the lines of her finding the shirts a while back, coming to the realization, and then finding peace with it after Jack was gone. In a way, meeting Ennis was probably the most important thing she needed. She needed to get to see what it was that Jack loved most in life, and to help comfort Ennis (guiding him to find the shirts, IMO) because she knew that's what Jack would've wanted. That was a favor to her son. What a sweet, sweet character. I loved her.
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Jerbear,
Just noticed your signature. Beautiful, man. What a great image!! Thanks.
Thanks, proulxfan. I got the idea from a gay couple. The mother of one of the guys read the entire poem at their commitment ceremony - as a surprise - NOBODY knew she was gonna do it. Needless to say, there was not a dry eye there.
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Maybe I'm way off base, but I think that, since there was no way in hell Ennis would ever accept an invitation back to the Twist's just to visit--and Jack's mom well knew that--her invitation was to return secretly and take Jack's ashes up to Brokeback the way Jack wanted--and to complete the circle. I further think Ennis' statement at the end after straightening the postcard of BBM, "Jack, I swear..." was a vow somehow to take Jack's ashes back to Brokeback.
I have always firmly believed that Jacks mother wanted Ennis to return so that she could see her sons wishes fulfilled and also to help the grieving Ennis through his pain. She wanted to give him that gift and I think she would have even if it caused Mr. TWIST to rage a bit.
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I'm glad I'm not the only person who thinks that Jack's mom wants Ennis to take his ashes to BBM. I think her body-language is very pointed in that she knows what these two men meant to one another, and she wants her baby to have his way as to where his ashes are laid to rest. When she looks at her husband, you can see a look of resignation on her face. She can't speak up out loud for Jack, because she has never spoken up for herself or Jack in her life -- how could she start now? I think that old man ruled the roost, but, we all know, that mama can find ways around the old bastard. She's a heart-breaking character to me, because I think her silence and acceptance of what life dealt her was, in the long run, a neqative thing. But, then again, it's the 60's when Jack was growing up. Many women ( more than now) just kept their mouth shut and let their man rule the family -- even when they knew he was harming her and the children.
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Exactly, her body language, how her back was turned to her husband when he spoke of how Jack is going in the family plot. She held eye contact with Ennis and looked pained to hear Mr. Twist say those things. Then the way she said come back.......
I'm glad i'm not the only one also. Part of the reason I sought out to revive this thread!
Thank You!!! :cr)
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Of course she knew . The emotional interaction between her and Ennis leaves no doubt. If it were'nt for the old man she would have allowed Ennis to leave with the ashes that very day.
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Of course she knew . The emotional interaction between her and Ennis leaves no doubt. If it were'nt for the old man she would have allowed Ennis to leave with the ashes that very day.
I second ;)
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Count me in too! I believe she would have let Ennis have the ashes because she knew what Ennis meant to Jack and she wanted her son's last wishes fulfilled.
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One of my private fantasies has always been that Ennis goes to Texas and digs up Jack's ashes there and then goes to Lightning Flats and digs up the rest of them and then goes to Brokeback and scatters them for Jack. I have several ending for that fantasy!
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One of my private fantasies has always been that Ennis goes to Texas and digs up Jack's ashes there and then goes to Lightning Flats and digs up the rest of them and then goes to Brokeback and scatters them for Jack. I have several ending for that fantasy!
AWWWWWWWWWWWWW, he would do it too!
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Uh oh, Do I feel a fan-fic coming on? great fantasy. I like to think that Eennis somehow brings the ashes together and scatters them on Brokeback Mt.someday.
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I'm pretty much convinced Jack's mother knew; the more interesting point is whether his father did. They've always had a difficult relationship and he must know how much his wife loved his son, so the refusal to let Ennis take Jack's ashes may have been just a way of getting at her and in a way punishing her for supporting a sone whom he could see only in a negative light. It's also a power struggle - what Ennis wants, what Jack wanted, what his mother wants, all are as nothing compared to what the stud duck wants. I wonder if he even has a deep-down suspicion that his wife not only knew about Jack but accepted what he was - so that in a sense it's her fault.
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That's an interesting point WW. I can certainly see the stud duck doing that to be punishing and spiteful.
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I'm pretty much convinced Jack's mother knew; the more interesting point is whether his father did. They've always had a difficult relationship and he must know how much his wife loved his son, so the refusal to let Ennis take Jack's ashes may have been just a way of getting at her and in a way punishing her for supporting a sone whom he could see only in a negative light. It's also a power struggle - what Ennis wants, what Jack wanted, what his mother wants, all are as nothing compared to what the stud duck wants. I wonder if he even has a deep-down suspicion that his wife not only knew about Jack but accepted what he was - so that in a sense it's her fault.
I definetely got the same impression of the "stud duck". Spite and punishment...horrible.