Topic: Who's saying, "I'm sorry"???

[JnE]

Okay, I must be the only person in the universe that has just now caught onto BBM.  So, I have all these questions and observations that I don't notice in the topics, but after all these years of it having been out, who knows?!!  Anyways, this question is simply that in the SNIT scene, after the first kiss, someone whispers, "I'm sorry".  From the placement of the subtitles, it appears to be Ennis, which would make sense, since he rode off so abruptly and chastised - albeit gently - Jack later, but his lips do not open to say the words at that time.  So, that leaves Jack, which it's hard to tell, but it does seem his lips part, whether for speaking or kissing, when the words are heard.  So, is it supposed to be Ennis and it's just a bad dubbing job (or perhaps he is an excellent ventriloquist?!!) or is it, indeed, Jack? ... And if so, why is he also the one saying, "It's alright... It's alright" (seemingly responding to Ennis', "I'm sorry"), and what would he be apologizing for, exactly, since he clearly isn't pulling back from his pursuit???  Anyone?

**Okay, another edit afterthought: Regardless of whether Ennis says, "I'm sorry", or not, the "It's alright, it's alright", can clearly be construed as a comforting sentiment to put Ennis' mind at rest and get him to feel at ease, as if caressing a child, but that still leaves the question of why Jack would be apologizing for something he so clearly is not sorry for or backing off of.  Or is it just one of those, "I'm sorry you're conflicted ... It will be alright", types of things???

[chowhound]

Okay, I must be the only person in the universe that has just now caught onto BBM.  So, I have all these questions and observations that I don't notice in the topics, but after all these years of it having been out, who knows?!!  Anyways, this question is simply that in the SNIT scene, after the first kiss, someone whispers, "I'm sorry".  From the placement of the subtitles, it appears to be Ennis, which would make sense, since he rode off so abruptly and chastised - albeit gently - Jack later, but his lips do not open to say the words at that time.  So, that leaves Jack, which it's hard to tell, but it does seem his lips part, whether for speaking or kissing, when the words are heard.  So, is it supposed to be Ennis and it's just a bad dubbing job (or perhaps he is an excellent ventriloquist?!!) or is it, indeed, Jack? ... And if so, why is he also the one saying, "It's alright... It's alright" (seemingly responding to Ennis', "I'm sorry"), and what would he be apologizing for, exactly, since he clearly isn't pulling back from his pursuit???  Anyone?

**Okay, another edit afterthought: Regardless of whether Ennis says, "I'm sorry", or not, the "It's alright, it's alright", can clearly be construed as a comforting sentiment to put Ennis' mind at rest and get him to feel at ease, as if caressing a child, but that still leaves the question of why Jack would be apologizing for something he so clearly is not sorry for or backing off of.  Or is it just one of those, "I'm sorry you're conflicted ... It will be alright", types of things???

Hi JnE,
   I well remember the battles that were fought over this topic some four years ago. However, the battles I'm referring to and of which I was part were not battles fought out on this board but on another board called IMDb. Indeed, it was the only board I was active on in the beginning. - I didn't join this board until somewhat later.

   So, what I've done, is to ask another "old" member of IMDb board if he has access to the thread on which all of this was fought out as I can't find it. It would certainly provide you with a useful introduction to the various points of view.

   On the other hand, maybe the same battles may have been fought on this board before I became a member. If so, maybe one of the older members here can link you up to a thread or threads on which this discussion took place.

[JnE]

Would love it, chowhound! I'm like this poor lone castaway who totally missed the boat... I finally make it back home and everyone's lookin' at me crosseyed like, "Where the heck have you been all these years!?!!" It's a different world! Lol!!!

[chowhound]

Here, JnE, is the reply of one of the "elders" from IMDb.:


"I've gotten in the habit of watching BBM once a year, on New Year's Eve. I decided to get it out & scene-select, so I could watch TS2 again and answer your question for the "new boy." (He sounds like a real winner--I'd love to meet him, if only online!)

I watched that scene as closely as I ever had. I'm pretty sure that Ennis does NOT say "I'm sorry"--in fact, I don't hear him saying anything at all. I think I hear Jack saying "It's all right" three times. Granted, that's on a regular-sized living-room TV, and I've noticed things on a big screen that I can't see at home--but that's what I just saw on my DVD.

What does HE think he hears in that scene? Please let me know."

Anyway, I'll pass on what you have to say to him and we'll see where it goes from there.

[Matt Nasty]

Hi JnE there was certainly alot of discussion on this a few years back and as mentioned weather im sorry was said at all is also a question, the way i always see it is that ennis is almost just breathing the words, which also explains why its not totally clear. but its one of those things that possibly just wont even be fully figured out.

[JnE]

I appreciate the "elder"'s input, chowhound. (Btw, girl here! )  What a conundrum!!  It's amazing how people can view the same shot and hear different things.  (I also still swear by my two, "Jack, I swear"'s!!!)  I try to hear it another way, to put it in a nice, neat, little box, but my ears will simply have none of it.  Then my mind tries to "logicalize" it, and hence (yes, I said hence ), the confusion right back again.  The subtitles show it too, but I am very aware of how often subtitles get it wrong.  As a matter of fact, the subtitles also show that Jack says, "Lie back...Come on", after the, "It's alright...It's alright".  Well, I certainly don't hear any of that!! (Maybe a barley audible, "Come on", but the only way he's saying, "Lie back", is if he's miming it!!!)  But I just put it on again and I am definitely hearing the, "I'm sorry", with my logical mind screaming, "Why isn't Ennis' mouth moving?!!!"  And, again, the subtitle placement puts the, "I'm sorry", right under Ennis' face, with the two, "It's alright"'s, on Jack's face.  So, I pretty much can't help but stay at my original unconcluded confounded conclusions: It either Ennis with a bad dubbing job or as a ventriloquist ... or Jack simply trying to put Ennis at ease, saying that he's sorry for whatever he might have done and for any and all things that Ennis is going through... and everything is alright, alright.  Well, it's like driving on one of those crazy circular roads that just keeps going round-n-round-n-round until someone finally has enough sense to turn off! Lol!!  Well, apparently it's not much progress, but it sure is an interesting contemplation process!!    

[JnE]

Hi Matt Nasty, it does seem that that is the only definite that one can come out with in all this.  A definite, indefinite! If Ennis would just move his dratted lips, this would all be settled already!!  I tell ya, what those two darlin' boys are puttin' me through!

[Matt Nasty]

Hi Matt Nasty, it does seem that that is the only definite that one can come out with in all this.  A definite, indefinite! If Ennis would just move his dratted lips, this would all be settled already!!  I tell ya, what those two darlin' boys are puttin' me through!

haha, its a shame you didnt get to see the movie while this forum was a bit more buzzing with ctivity in the discussion groups but im sure your posts will still be eagerly  met with discussions and debates :D

[JnE]

Thanks, Matt Nasty! I think I musta been hidin' under a rock somewhere.   That'll teach me.