Author Topic: Lureen: Did she ever really love Jack? (Read 23449 times)

Patriot1 · « **on:** Aug 17, 2006, 05:19 PM »

I saw nothing in the movie that made me feel Lureen really loved Jack.

Alma showed she loved Ennis. She frolicked with Ennis on the tobaggon run. She cuddled with him in the bedroom. She had "regular" sex with him. They went to the fireworks together. There were numerous instances in the movie which showed Alma loved Ennis.

Not true with Lureen and Jack. Only time we saw them intimate was in the back seat of the car and she was bound and determined to get pregnant. She even stopped to ask if she was going too fast. She was in a hurry to get pregnant.

So I ask again, did she ever really love or care about him?

tpe · « **Reply #1 on:** Aug 17, 2006, 05:37 PM »

Hello Patriot1. Thanks for starting this new topic.

I think by the time they exchanged that "distant" kiss (after they discuss Bobby's tutor), Lureen was probably not in love with Jack -- at least this iseems to be implied by the Screenplay. This does not mean that she no longer had any feelings for her husband. But it was probably no longer what can be considered a romantic love.

Habit is stronger than hate -- so goes the old saying. There is some comfort to be had in someone you are used to. Perhaps this (or just plain indifference) was the only thing that kept them together for so long, other than Bobby, of course. But I think that they did not hate each other, even when they reached a point that they no longer loved each other.

As for the early phase of their marriage, I really don't know. I would like to think that there was some initial love between Jack and Lureen. After all, the younger Lureen seemed to be very different from the hardened older persona of later years. But I really cant's say with exactitude. Which is why I am interested in hearing others express their opinions here...

jesseanne21 · « **Reply #2 on:** Aug 17, 2006, 05:47 PM »

I think Lureen was definitely attracted to Jack in the begiinning and he had some attraction for her, but attaction is not love.

Lureen pursued Jack and she was just convenient for him. I think at some point she may have realized that. There was no real connection between them (you could see that at the dance with LaShawn and Randall). I think Lureen made her work her lover when she couldn't get the love she wanted from Jack.

I remember when I was young, my grandmother giving advice about men to one of her daughters. She cautioned her to not chase after some guy, because she might think that she was "Miss Right" and to him she would just be "Miss Right Now." He'd stay with her until someone better came along.

I think Lureen realized that she was just a substitute to Jack and when she spoke to Ennis about Brokeback Mountain after Jack's death she realized who she was substiituting for.

WyMe · « **Reply #3 on:** Aug 17, 2006, 05:57 PM »

I think she was very fond of him - but I suspect they rarely, if ever, had sex with him in the later years Jack said as much. She appreciated him as a good salesman (even though this was tempered by her "well, only salesman" remark) and he appeared to be a nice friendly guy. But the nearest we ever see to love - or maybe it's respect - is the little smile at Thanksgiving. I still think the tears on the phone are the tears of, well, is 'humiliation' too strong? She was cuckolded after all. Incidentally, I think Anne Hathaway is superb in that scene - so good in extreme close-up.

CrimsonSky · « **Reply #4 on:** Aug 17, 2006, 06:26 PM »

I think she was definitely "in love" with him at the beginning,she was smitten from the moment she set eyes on him (well, who wouldn't be?

), but I'm not sure if she actually "loved" him,in the long term, once the "honeymoon period" had worn off. She might have done if things had been different,and there's not much to go on, either in the film or the ss, but my guess is that she got pregnant pretty quickly (although I'm not sure she had an ulterior motive there, I think she was worried she was going too fast cause she thought Jack might think she was easy, having sex with him after knowing him for just a couple of hours) and after that, with her parents taking over, Jack re-established contact with Ennis, and my guess is that after the reunion Jack probably became distant from her, physically and emotionally, and it made her bitter and hardened towards Jack.I think there was still some affection between them, albeit not physically, judging by the way Jack touches her in the Thanskgiving scene, and I think part of her wished that things had worked out(she wouldn't have made the comment about husbands not dancing (ie having sex) with their wives, if she wasn't disappointed and upset that Jack obviously didn't want her in that way)I just think she wanted more from Jack than he was able to give

Rosie · « **Reply #5 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 07:55 AM »

A lot of what we think has to be specualtion because we are not shown enough of the early relationship between Jack and Lureen in the movie IMO.
I think Lureen fell madly in love with Jack. Just my opinion. (I'm one of the hopeless Romantics here

)
If we knew whether their marriage was because she was pregnant or not it would make the knowing that much easier. But we don't. If she wasn't pregnant, she had no reason to marry Jack other than being in love with him. She was a very beautiful, rich young girl. A catch for most men and probably had no trouble attracting them. Maybe Jack being not so eager as the rest is what attracted her to him in the first place, along with him being exceptionally handsome and charming of course!
If she was pregnant, then that puts a different slant on things, especially in the 1960's (I'm assuming here, because I don't actually know...wasn't there at the time!)
But just my opinion, I think she did love him in the beginning. Madly and passionately. As to whether it matured, then I don't think it did. Jack was certainly looking for more than Lureen very quickly and she must have been able to sense it. By the end I think they had convenience and companionship and a shared love for Bobby.

welshwitch · « **Reply #6 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 07:59 AM »

I think she saw him at the rodeo, had a second look as he was riding the bull, fancied him like mad by the time they were in the bar and went straight for what she wanted. whether intense physical desire necessarily leads on to deeply-founded love ("whatever love is" to quote the heir to the throne) I'm not sure. Certainly Jack wrote to Enns to say he'd be in Riverton at the end of june '67, when Bobby was eight months old ( so he was born in Sept '66, which means Lureen got pregnant in Dec '65/Jan '66, or a while before she met Jack if you follow the screenplay's dodgy dates!) by which time the Newsomes had made it clear that Jack wasn't wanted and Lureen was doing nothing about that. Certainly by the scene by the river all Jack says is that LD will pay him to getlost and he seems quite willing to take advantage of this, so there appears to be little between them.

It seems from her behavior that Lureen puts all her energies into the business and has little time for Jack, but whether that's because she has stopped loving him because she's suspicious about his fishing trips or because she was simply infatuated and the feeling has burnt out or because she's under her father's thiumb or determined to impress him and is less in terested in Jack than in making money it's impossible to say. It might be that she did love him, but that her love disappeared - as Rhett Butler tells Scarlett O'Hara, "even the most deathless love can wear out" - in the face of Jack's indifference. Again, it's impssible to tell.

For my money she felt something for him for a while but whatever it was had worn off by the time Bobby was born and after than was simply habit or a reluctance to go against convention and divorce Jack.

Patriot1 · « **Reply #7 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 12:37 PM »

Quote from: Rosie on Aug 18, 2006, 07:55 AM

If we knew whether their marriage was because she was pregnant or not it would make the knowing that much easier. But we don't. If she wasn't pregnant, she had no reason to marry Jack other than being in love with him. She was a very beautiful, rich young girl. A catch for most men and probably had no trouble attracting them. Maybe Jack being not so eager as the rest is what attracted her to him in the first place, along with him being exceptionally handsome and charming of course!

But Rosie, I think we do know she was pregnant before they got married.

When Ennis got married we saw a little wedding scene. Not so with Jack. We go from the back of the car to Lureen in bed with the baby. A moviemakers method of saying the baby was the result of the activities in the car. If she had not become pregnant her father would never have approved of the wedding. He hated Jack. This marriage was so soiled and disapproved of that we don't even get to see a little wedding ceremony in the office of the Justice of the Peace (civil wedding).

I put your next statement in bold, not because I think you said anything wrong, but because here we have a danger. Many people like to use the ss to prove their points, including me. But we can not pick and choose what we like from the short story and ignore the rest. The ss tells us Jack was a short, pudgy, curly haired and buck toothed young man. Definitely not someone Lureen would choose to be her husband unless she had ulterior motives, like displeasing her father. The movie made Jack a heartthrob but you know, it didn't change the ss one bit. Lureen still got pregnant in the back of the car. Her father still didn't have a choice in letting her marry Jack. And her father still hated Jack and those were the points in both the ss and the movie.

Rosie · « **Reply #8 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 01:18 PM »

Quote from: Patriot1 on Aug 18, 2006, 12:37 PM

Quote from: Rosie on Aug 18, 2006, 07:55 AM

If we knew whether their marriage was because she was pregnant or not it would make the knowing that much easier. But we don't. If she wasn't pregnant, she had no reason to marry Jack other than being in love with him. She was a very beautiful, rich young girl. A catch for most men and probably had no trouble attracting them. Maybe Jack being not so eager as the rest is what attracted her to him in the first place, along with him being exceptionally handsome and charming of course!

But Rosie, I think we do know she was pregnant before they got married.

When Ennis got married we saw a little wedding scene. Not so with Jack. We go from the back of the car to Lureen in bed with the baby. A moviemakers method of saying the baby was the result of the activities in the car. If she had not become pregnant her father would never have approved of the wedding. He hated Jack. This marriage was so soiled and disapproved of that we don't even get to see a little wedding ceremony in the office of the Justice of the Peace (civil wedding).

I put your next statement in bold, not because I think you said anything wrong, but because here we have a danger. Many people like to use the ss to prove their points, including me. But we can not pick and choose what we like from the short story and ignore the rest. The ss tells us Jack was a short, pudgy, curly haired and buck toothed young man. Definitely not someone Lureen would choose to be her husband unless she had ulterior motives, like displeasing her father. The movie made Jack a heartthrob but you know, it didn't change the ss one bit. Lureen still got pregnant in the back of the car. Her father still didn't have a choice in letting her marry Jack. And her father still hated Jack and those were the points in both the ss and the movie.

Hi Patriot1

I was talking about the movie Jack here, although I still loved the short story Jack even if he was short, pudgy, curly haired and buck toothed. But I do take your point. We're talking about Lureen here, not me!

And yes I do agree that showing us the back of the car, and then straight on to the baby scene, could definitely be the movie makers way of saying that the baby was a result of the car activities. Never thought of it that way before. But actually the point that struck me most in your post was about Lureens father hating Jack. If she was not pregnant, would she have been strong enough to marry Jack against her fathers wishes? I don't think so - and I hadn't thought of that before either. (Always something new to think about with this movie.) And if you follow that through, it could be that LD wanted Jack to marry Lureen to make the baby legitimate, but once that was done he then wanted to pay him to go away. Umm.. I think you could be right here.

Damn, this is getting less Romantic by the second.

Rosie
x

aimi15 · « **Reply #9 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 01:47 PM »

Very interesting discussion.

It has made me wonder if the tears that Lureen (almost) sheds during the phone call, were out of some genuine affection towards Jack, or more out of a memory of what could have been.

I never really got the impression of there being any great love between Lureen and Jack, maybe lust in the beginning which led to a familiarity. Convenient for them both, Jack had his own life beyond the marriage - perhaps Lureen did too? Who knows.

The banter between them, when Jack can't find his parka, intrigued me too. There was no real nastiness or intent in the argument - not that i saw anyway, more an apathy. It was as if some ground had been reached where Lureen would voice her feelings, (the comment about Ennis never coming to Texas), but she wouldn't make demands on Jack. Maybe this showed her lack of feeling? Maybe she was pretty content with the way things were, Jack having his own life and she having hers, but i still get confused by the phone call at the end. Would she have become so bitter if she didn't care?

LOL, sorry for all the questions, this subject has really intrigued me. Thanks for strating it Patriot1

welshwitch · « **Reply #10 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 03:49 PM »

A lot of that scene suggests a sort of familiar routine which engages neither very deeply. the way her voice fades out as Jack leaves also suggests that she knows she's wasting her breath, but that doesn't seem to irritate her much - she makes no attempt to stop Jack and the impression i get is that she doesn't much care whether he goes or stays as long as he's back when the new tractor arrives to sell it an dmake more money for the family business.

WyMe · « **Reply #11 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 04:02 PM »

I still think the tears at the end are mostly those of humiliation. She was a country girl from the 70s and 80s. Good looking and vivacious. The idea that her husband "Rodeo" should be unfaithful wrecks her, and that it would should be with a man!! I also think that she would be very concerned about what people would say - maybe even its effect on her business.

tpe · « **Reply #12 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 05:00 PM »

Quote from: WyMe on Aug 18, 2006, 04:02 PM

I still think the tears at the end are mostly those of humiliation. She was a country girl from the 70s and 80s. Good looking and vivacious. The idea that her husband "Rodeo" should be unfaithful wrecks her, and that it would should be with a man!! I also think that she would be very concerned about what people would say - maybe even its effect on her business.

There is certainly more than a grain of truth to this, although I would also agree that she probably was truly sad, for memory's sake. But she must have also felt humiliated by the revelation.

Patriot1 · « **Reply #13 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 07:21 PM »

Quote from: aimi15 on Aug 18, 2006, 01:47 PM

Very interesting discussion.

It has made me wonder if the tears that Lureen (almost) sheds during the phone call, were out of some genuine affection towards Jack, or more out of a memory of what could have been.

I never really got the impression of there being any great love between Lureen and Jack, maybe lust in the beginning which led to a familiarity. Convenient for them both, Jack had his own life beyond the marriage - perhaps Lureen did too? Who knows.

The banter between them, when Jack can't find his parka, intrigued me too. There was no real nastiness or intent in the argument - not that i saw anyway, more an apathy. It was as if some ground had been reached where Lureen would voice her feelings, (the comment about Ennis never coming to Texas), but she wouldn't make demands on Jack. Maybe this showed her lack of feeling? Maybe she was pretty content with the way things were, Jack having his own life and she having hers, but i still get confused by the phone call at the end. Would she have become so bitter if she didn't care?

LOL, sorry for all the questions, this subject has really intrigued me. Thanks for strating it Patriot1

I can think of one reason she might have become so bitter. Let me offer it to you and see what you think.

When she met Jack she knew her dad would not like Jack. He was just a poor bull rider that wasn't very good a bull riding. Just not the type of guy her dad would like. She wanted to get back at her dad so she goes after Jack, getting him interested in her, the pretty and rich young girl. She then gets Jack into the back of her daddy's car, another thing against her dad, and intends to get pregnant so she will have to marry him. She sees that Jack is interested in her and tells her "fast or slow I like the direction your going", intercourse.

She gets pregnant, marries Jack, and makes her father angry. Mission accomplished. She then becomes involved in the business and turns all her attention to it figuring if Jack didn't like it he could divorce her. Unknown to her, though, this was fine with Jack and a friendly relationship develops. You do your thing and I'll do mine. Just don't let your thing interfear with the business.

Then, she finds out Jack was having a relationship with another man, Randall, and was killed because of it.

This had to be humiliating to Lureen. Better Jack have a relationship with "Chatty Cathy" than "Chatty Cathy's" HUSBAND.

Then, Ennis calls. She recognizes the name as the fishing or hunting buddy Jack has been seeing for the past 20 years. She also knew that Jack's favorite place was Brokeback Mountain but she never knew why it was his favorite place or even if there was such a place as Brokeback.

Then Ennis lowers the boom on her. Ennis confirms there is such a place as Brokeback and ONE summer he and Jack herded sheep up there. Suddenly, and without warning, Lureen finds out that before Jack met her he fell in love with Ennis and because he was in love with Ennis he fell in love with Brokeback Mountain, the place where they had met. And, for 20 years Jack and Ennis would get together twice a year to consumate his love for Ennis.

This HAD to have hurt her pretty little rich girl ego if nothing else. He never loved me. Before he met me he was already in love with someone else, and it was with a guy at that. That little bustard (sic) was using me to get a comfortable life!

Wow! Talk about humiliating!

Anyway, that is how I see it and I offer it to you to cogitate on.

chameau · « **Reply #14 on:** Aug 18, 2006, 09:27 PM »

Quote

But Rosie, I think we do know she was pregnant before they got married.

When Ennis got married we saw a little wedding scene. Not so with Jack. We go from the back of the car to Lureen in bed with the baby. A moviemakers method of saying the baby was the result of the activities in the car. If she had not become pregnant her father would never have approved of the wedding. He hated Jack. This marriage was so soiled and disapproved of that we don't even get to see a little wedding ceremony in the office of the Justice of the Peace (civil wedding).

Very interesting thread, I share Patriot1's point of view here, she was probably pregnant from their ''intimate encounter'' in the car. It was 1966 when Bobby was borned (since Ennis & Jack met again after 4 years on June 24th 1967, Bobby was then 8 months old). In these days, it was almost automatic wedding when a woman got pregnant from her ''boyfriend''. Now, was Jack her boyfriend? It's off topic anyways, but I don't think so. He acted as a gentleman since she was pregnant and married her.

This was my 2 cents.

NoReins · « **Reply #15 on:** Aug 19, 2006, 02:18 AM »

Quote from: Patriot1 on Aug 18, 2006, 07:21 PM

I can think of one reason she might have become so bitter. Let me offer it to you and see what you think.

When she met Jack she knew her dad would not like Jack. He was just a poor bull rider that wasn't very good a bull riding. Just not the type of guy her dad would like. She wanted to get back at her dad so she goes after Jack, getting him interested in her, the pretty and rich young girl. She then gets Jack into the back of her daddy's car, another thing against her dad, and intends to get pregnant so she will have to marry him. She sees that Jack is interested in her and tells her "fast or slow I like the direction your going", intercourse.

She gets pregnant, marries Jack, and makes her father angry. Mission accomplished. She then becomes involved in the business and turns all her attention to it figuring if Jack didn't like it he could divorce her. Unknown to her, though, this was fine with Jack and a friendly relationship develops. You do your thing and I'll do mine. Just don't let your thing interfear with the business.

Then, she finds out Jack was having a relationship with another man, Randall, and was killed because of it.

This had to be humiliating to Lureen. Better Jack have a relationship with "Chatty Cathy" than "Chatty Cathy's" HUSBAND.

Then, Ennis calls. She recognizes the name as the fishing or hunting buddy Jack has been seeing for the past 20 years. She also knew that Jack's favorite place was Brokeback Mountain but she never knew why it was his favorite place or even if there was such a place as Brokeback.

Then Ennis lowers the boom on her. Ennis confirms there is such a place as Brokeback and ONE summer he and Jack herded sheep up there. Suddenly, and without warning, Lureen finds out that before Jack met her he fell in love with Ennis and because he was in love with Ennis he fell in love with Brokeback Mountain, the place where they had met. And, for 20 years Jack and Ennis would get together twice a year to consumate his love for Ennis.

This HAD to have hurt her pretty little rich girl ego if nothing else. He never loved me. Before he met me he was already in love with someone else, and it was with a guy at that. That little bustard (sic) was using me to get a comfortable life!

Wow! Talk about humiliating!

Anyway, that is how I see it and I offer it to you to cogitate on.

I think, Patriot1, that you have just summed it up perfectly

As long as Lureen thinks that Jack did love her/want her for more than her money, she is happy. She doesn't need the things that a marriage should bring, because she is in love with the business and it gives her all the pleasure she needs. But finding out that Jack was in love with Ennis before he even met her, and continued to be in love with him for the rest of his life - which by extension shows that he never loved her (or certainly was never in love with her) - is like an arrow through her heart.

welshwitch · « **Reply #16 on:** Aug 19, 2006, 11:38 AM »

I agree with Patriot 1 too. If Lureen is faced after his death with the knowledge that jack was never what she thought him, and was using her to some degree to achieve a comfortble life, it must make her suddenly see their whole life together in a different light. she must feel she's been taken in and made use of, apart from the fact that it musy be evident that whatever Jack felt, or said he felt, for her, it was never what he felt for Ennis.

Toadily · « **Reply #17 on:** Aug 19, 2006, 03:04 PM »

I remember Ann in an interview saying how would it be if the most romantic moment in your life you were 19? I am sure Lureen had a hold on Jack and mistook that for love. It's sort of like when you want someting with all your might as a kid and then you get it and it's disappointing. And by the time she realized it she had a kid and you just don't divorce easily back then. So she just got into being rich.

welshwitch · « **Reply #18 on:** Aug 21, 2006, 01:11 AM »

Divorce was much harder back then, but it was also less accepted - Lureen might not have wanted to divorce Jack even if there was little reason to stay together. He is involved in the business and helping them make money, and to divorce him would presumably have meant he'd leave - then there was Bobby. Lureen was going to be on her own if she divorced Jack and admitting that her marriage was a failure - probably easier to stick together and put up with each other. Whatever they'd felt at first, I think that's waht it came down to long before Jack died.

tpe · « **Reply #19 on:** Aug 21, 2006, 07:22 AM »

Quote from: welshwitch on Aug 21, 2006, 01:11 AM

Divorce was much harder back then, but it was also less accepted - Lureen might not have wanted to divorce Jack even if there was little reason to stay together. He is involved in the business and helping them make money, and to divorce him would presumably have meant he'd leave - then there was Bobby. Lureen was going to be on her own if she divorced Jack and admitting that her marriage was a failure - probably easier to stick together and put up with each other. Whatever they'd felt at first, I think that's waht it came down to long before Jack died.

Being a good businessperson, I guess Lureen was quite pragmatic about all this.

welshwitch · « **Reply #20 on:** Aug 21, 2006, 08:16 AM »

And I can't see her as the sort to fall in love again, if she did in the first place - easier to have a husband who is, in essence, a live-in business partner, whatever his sexual orientation. I reckon she knew there was something going on but chose not to know, so to speak - much easier to ignore it all.

lamusica · « **Reply #21 on:** Aug 25, 2006, 06:46 AM »

I surely don't want the younger folks out there to take this the wrong way, but I think Lureen loved Jack as a young girl loves a fella who is funny, cute ( not necessarity good-looking), rather happy-go-lucky. He was a part of her rodeo world, hadjust won a bullriding contest, was gallant enough to pick up and return her hat, was a good dancer. Did she look any deeper? I doubt it. I think she would have done anything to get out from under her father's thumb. Jack came along and he looked pretty interesting to her, and she went for it ( take that anyway you want to). Now, when it comes to real love that weathers all kinds of storms along with the good times, and grows more and more solid and strong as the years go by, well, I don't think she understood that kind of love. She just kept it all together from lack of knowing anything better was out there.

welshwitch · « **Reply #22 on:** Aug 25, 2006, 07:43 AM »

I agree - their relationship has no really solid foundations . It's based on appearance and physical attraction and has nothin g underlying those to keep it together when the thrilll of those wears off.

tpe · « **Reply #23 on:** Aug 25, 2006, 08:46 AM »

Quote from: lamusica on Aug 25, 2006, 06:46 AM

I surely don't want the younger folks out there to take this the wrong way, but I think Lureen loved Jack as a young girl loves a fella who is funny, cute ( not necessarity good-looking), rather happy-go-lucky. He was a part of her rodeo world, hadjust won a bullriding contest, was gallant enough to pick up and return her hat, was a good dancer. Did she look any deeper? I doubt it. I think she would have done anything to get out from under her father's thumb. Jack came along and he looked pretty interesting to her, and she went for it ( take that anyway you want to). Now, when it comes to real love that weathers all kinds of storms along with the good times, and grows more and more solid and strong as the years go by, well, I don't think she understood that kind of love. She just kept it all together from lack of knowing anything better was out there.

Very good point. Perhaps it was a love that never really matured and died before it could?

lamusica · « **Reply #24 on:** Aug 26, 2006, 09:50 PM »

I think that might also be why she has tears in her eyes when speaking with Ennis on the phone. Perhaps now, as she is older, she realizes what she never had with Jack and it was for this lost chance at real love that makes her sad. Just something to think about. I think her tears are genuine, but they may be for the old memories of Jack rather than for his loss, know what I mean?

Carefree Wind · « **Reply #25 on:** Aug 27, 2006, 03:31 AM »

Quote

Perhaps now, as she is older, she realizes what she never had with Jack and it was for this lost chance at real love that makes her sad.

That sentence brings to my mind...something that both Lureen and Ennis share in common...

Lost chances...lost hopes and dreams...of sharing love/life with the one person they both loved. Ennis through fear...Lureen through Jack's undying love for Ennis. Both handled it the best they could..in their own ways.

I don't doubt that Lureen did infact love Jack. When she couldn't have Jack completely...she turned to the next best thing..to help distract her mind and heart from the pain...the business. When Jack couldn't have Ennis completely and wholy..he too turned to the next best thing...other men..meaningless encounters. Jack deserves alot of credit for staying with Lureen..even though his love and heart belonged to someone else. And it's damn hard to be a part of a family (Lureen's Father etc) that does not accept you as well.

Their love may have been genuine at the beginning...but faded over time..due to various factors. Perhaps their marriage might have lasted for a few more years..such as it was...had Jack not died. A marriage that had become based on mostly friendship..rather than love.

tpe · « **Reply #26 on:** Aug 29, 2006, 07:53 AM »

Quote from: Carefree Wind on Aug 27, 2006, 03:31 AM

Quote
Perhaps now, as she is older, she realizes what she never had with Jack and it was for this lost chance at real love that makes her sad.

That sentence brings to my mind...something that both Lureen and Ennis share in common...

Lost chances...lost hopes and dreams...of sharing love/life with the one person they both loved. Ennis through fear...Lureen through Jack's undying love for Ennis. Both handled it the best they could..in their own ways.

I don't doubt that Lureen did infact love Jack. When she couldn't have Jack completely...she turned to the next best thing..to help distract her mind and heart from the pain...the business. When Jack couldn't have Ennis completely and wholy..he too turned to the next best thing...other men..meaningless encounters. Jack deserves alot of credit for staying with Lureen..even though his love and heart belonged to someone else. And it's damn hard to be a part of a family (Lureen's Father etc) that does not accept you as well.

Their love may have been genuine at the beginning...but faded over time..due to various factors. Perhaps their marriage might have lasted for a few more years..such as it was...had Jack not died. A marriage that had become based on mostly friendship..rather than love.

Thank you, Carefree Wind. Your post is wonderful.

jeffjoe · « **Reply #27 on:** Sep 08, 2006, 11:49 PM »

I really believe, she just feel attraction for him (but who can blame her

) love, truth love, maybe not, is just an agreement marriage, she was happy only in her work and he is another part of the contract no more

welshwitch · « **Reply #28 on:** Sep 09, 2006, 12:11 PM »

And before our romantic notions of marruage came along, that's what marrtiage oftern was, and in some cultures still is. The notion of falling in love and marrying for that reason alone is a fairly recent one.

One of the things keeping them tiogether, oddly, may have been that they worked together - shared activities can be a link. Jack only dislikes her later, when it's obvious she's more obsessed with making money than anything else, but that's partly his fault since she must see he isnl't deeply involved with her.

tpe · « **Reply #29 on:** Sep 09, 2006, 03:21 PM »

The young Lureen (when Jack first met her) seemed worlds away even from the Lureen a few years into the marriage. But they did initially see to relish sharing some responsibility for the family business.

In the scene where Lureen asks Jack why Ennis never came down to Texas to fish, the screenplay differs a bit from the movie version. It would seem that by that time, Jack was quite indespensible, as only he could drive some of the new tractors -- something that the elder Newsome could not go without. But at this stage, it was evident that their love (if there was one to begin with) had cooled off -- since the farewell kiss was described in the screenplay as very distant. This was probably the time period when their mutual involvement in the business no longer proved strong enough to rekindle any old affections between them...