Topic: More Lame Questions: Why DIDN"T They Catch Any Fish?

[Uptown_Gal]

OK, it's the Town Mouse again, the livestock ignoramus.  I have corny animal questions:   

At viewing #3 (Ain't it pathetic?), it dawned on me.  How come Jack and Ennis never caught and ate any fish?  I saw frequent camp scenes by the water.  Is it because mountain freshwater is too cold or shallow to sustain any aquatic life?  However, even the oceans surrounding Antarctica sustain krill.  Essentially, are you able to catch fish from the streams of Wyoming mountains? 

Next, I have a question about sheep.  Are sheep more profitable for their wool or for their meat?  I mean, even though people eat lamb, it's hardly as popular as beef.  What likely would have been Joe Aguirre's plans for the sheep after they came down from Brokeback Mountain?  Slaughter?  Wool shearing?  Doesn't the homophobic and hardened Aguirre seem more of a cattle man than a sheep man? 

Ennis responded to Cassie that he was "castratin' calves" earlier in the day.  Is it true that castrating cows makes their meat more tender and palatable?  If that's the case, are then the majority of the beef we eat male?  Female cows are initially spared slaughter because they produce milk, another commodity?     

For some strange reason, the movie has stimulated my interest in learning about livestock.  Thanks for indulging my weird questions.

[rikcub]

OK, it's the Town Mouse again, the livestock ignoramus.  I have corny animal questions:   

At viewing #3 (Ain't it pathetic?), it dawned on me.  How come Jack and Ennis never caught and ate any fish?  I saw frequent camp scenes by the water.  Is it because mountain freshwater is too cold or shallow to sustain any aquatic life?  However, even the oceans surrounding Antarctica sustain krill.  Essentially, are you able to catch fish from the streams of Wyoming mountains? 

Next, I have a question about sheep.  Are sheep more profitable for their wool or for their meat?  I mean, even though people eat lamb, it's hardly as popular as beef.  What likely would have been Joe Aguirre's plans for the sheep after they came down from Brokeback Mountain?  Slaughter?  Wool shearing?  Doesn't the homophobic and hardened Aguirre seem more of a cattle man than a sheep man? 

Ennis responded to Cassie that he was "castratin' calves" earlier in the day.  Is it true that castrating cows makes their meat more tender and palatable?  If that's the case, are then the majority of the beef we eat male?  Female cows are initially spared slaughter because they produce milk, another commodity?     

For some strange reason, the movie has stimulated my interest in learning about livestock.  Thanks for indulging my weird questions.

I have absolutely no idea about questions 2 and 3 but as for the fish my answer to a similar question on the Yahoo board was:  With all the pent up emotion and energy, and the little time together, they didn't waste any of it fishing!  I mean who would have??     

[justlikethisalways]

As for not fishing, other than the fact that it's needed for plotline development (if Ennis brings home fish, it weakens Alma's suspicions and dilutes the "Jack Nasty" scene), I agree w/rikcub. Their meetings were infrequent and so special that the LAST thing on their mind was, er, "fish".    And Ennis wasn't the calculating type who'd think ahead and bring home fish as 'cover' for his story.

I too am a livestock ignoramus. Going a little OT, but since you brought up castrating calves -- I tried Rocky Mountain oysters once in Cheyenne, WY and liked it! Great with beer. Heck I like fried liver too. Oh well I'm into "organ meats"   

[rabjr1]

   
     they caught "trouser trout"

[JerBear418720]

   
     they caught "trouser trout"

HAHA!   

[Sanne]

^^ LMAO

[*Froggy*]

they caught "trouser trout"

hahahahahahahahahahahahaha!

[Apollonos]

And they weren't gonna bring any back home!!!   

[garymcd]

hello,
it was not about fishing in any way shape or form.  it was an excuse to spend one on one time with each other if not on each other.  i'll have to review the other questions...

[justlikethisalways]

     they caught "trouser trout"

BWAAHAHAHA!  

But I think Jack did all the "catching".  

[garymcd]

jack definite caught ennis,    BAD

 It could be like this, just like this, always

There ain't never enough time, never enough...

Once in a while? Every four fu**in' years?

Swear I didn't know we were gonna get into this again. Hell, yes I did, redlined it all the way, couldn't get here fast enough.

Tell you what. The truth is...sometimes I miss you so much I can hardly stand it.

nuff said

[cybernaut]

I have absolutely no idea about questions 2 and 3 but as for the fish my answer to a similar question on the Yahoo board was:  With all the pent up emotion and energy, and the little time together, they didn't waste any of it fishing!  I mean who would have??     

I wouldn't! haha!  :D

Like what Ennis said of Jack, "If you don't quiet down, you will run off the sheep(or fishes) again!" :D

[Cowboy Cody]

I have absolutely no idea about questions 2 and 3 but as for the fish my answer to a similar question on the Yahoo board was:  With all the pent up emotion and energy, and the little time together, they didn't waste any of it fishing!  I mean who would have??     

I wouldn't! haha!  :D

Like what Ennis said of Jack, "If you don't quiet down, you will run off the sheep(or fishes) again!" :D

Only a few times a year, I sure ain't a wasting it on catching fish, I've got better things to go fishin' for in that situation!

[camom]

Around here, lamb is pretty gourmet stuff.  After we saw BBM the first time, I told my husband, "Now why couldn't Ennis and Jack have moved out here, raised organic lamb, made a killing and lived happily ever after?"  Well, OK, so the movie wouldn't be nearly as good, and the time frame is all wrong, but still--I want my happy ending.   :'(

I think castrating beef makes them put on fat more easily, so they can be taken to market quicker.  Also, it probably mellows them out somewhat.  The beef you buy in the supermarket is probably all male (steers).  The beef cows are breeders, and when milk cows get too old, not sure what they do with them.  They're too old for steaks and stuff like that, so probably hamburger.  Just my guess on that one. 

camom

[Cowboy Cody]

Around here, lamb is pretty gourmet stuff.  After we saw BBM the first time, I told my husband, "Now why couldn't Ennis and Jack have moved out here, raised organic lamb, made a killing and lived happily ever after?"  Well, OK, so the movie wouldn't be nearly as good, and the time frame is all wrong, but still--I want my happy ending.   :'(

camom

Damn, that's the 64 Million Dollar question right there camom. I wanted a happy ending to, but I wanted true to how things sometimes work in life and as my niece would say, life isn't always fair (at the age of 4)!

[camom]

Around here, lamb is pretty gourmet stuff.  After we saw BBM the first time, I told my husband, "Now why couldn't Ennis and Jack have moved out here, raised organic lamb, made a killing and lived happily ever after?"  Well, OK, so the movie wouldn't be nearly as good, and the time frame is all wrong, but still--I want my happy ending.   :'(

camom

Damn, that's the 64 Million Dollar question right there camom. I wanted a happy ending to, but I wanted true to how things sometimes work in life and as my niece would say, life isn't always fair (at the age of 4)!

My mom used to always say, "Life is unfair."  I always hated that!  Of course, I say it to my kids now, heheheheh. 

Let's face it, if BBM had a happy ending, we probably wouldn't all be here obsessing about it.  Or going to see it umpteen times, bawling like babies!   

camom

[vedrana]

What I am saying here is that Ennis and Jack had been on the mountain for so many times during years, and they have never ever cast the hook even one time?? Please don't say : You stupid woman! (as Rene to his wife), cos I was thinking about this a lots of times, and still find this fact illogical.

If I spend a few days on the mountain with my "little darling", a few hours of fishing would be just another way to enjoy the lovely company and a beautiful nature. I mean, they were not making love 24/7!

Is it normal to avoid fishing as a natural amusement on the mountains or not? Maybe as a person who adores fishing, I am not the best judge for this matter, but let me hear others' opinion!

PS: Hm... maybe Ennis divorced Alma, because he hated all the fuss about taking fishing equipment!

[tpe]

What I am saying here is that Ennis and Jack had been on the mountain for so many times during years, and they have never ever cast the hook even one time?? Please don't say : You stupid woman! (as Rene to his wife), cos I was thinking about this a lots of times, and still find this fact illogical.

If I spend a few days on the mountain with my "little darling", a few hours of fishing would be just another way to enjoy the lovely company and a beautiful nature. I mean, they were not making love 24/7!

Is it normal to avoid fishing as a natural amusement on the mountains or not? Maybe as a person who adores fishing, I am not the best judge for this matter, but let me hear others' opinion!

PS: Hm... maybe Ennis divorced Alma, because he hated all the fuss about taking fishing equipment!

Well, perhaps it all the more shows Ennis's blatant disregard for what Alma may have thought -- especially after the marriage had started to slide downhill.  Perhaps he even did this INTENTIONALLY -- to show how much he didn't care. 

[aintfoolin]

What I am saying here is that Ennis and Jack had been on the mountain for so many times during years, and they have never ever cast the hook even one time?? Please don't say : You stupid woman! (as Rene to his wife), cos I was thinking about this a lots of times, and still find this fact illogical.

If I spend a few days on the mountain with my "little darling", a few hours of fishing would be just another way to enjoy the lovely company and a beautiful nature. I mean, they were not making love 24/7!

Is it normal to avoid fishing as a natural amusement on the mountains or not? Maybe as a person who adores fishing, I am not the best judge for this matter, but let me hear others' opinion!

PS: Hm... maybe Ennis divorced Alma, because he hated all the fuss about taking fishing equipment!

 Yep, some of the best fishing is in the  mountain stream, but the "fishing buddy" story was just part of the *cover*. Ennis used the excuse that whatever they caught, they  "ate them all up" before they got home. Alma had to remind Ennis at one point, to take his tackle, net etc...slipping...

[chameau]

At Thanksgiving, when Alma confronts Ennis in her kitchen, what she said is quite explicative:

(from the short story, it's almost word for word what was kept in the screenplay and the movie)

“You know,” she said, and from her tone he knew something was coming, “I used to wonder how come you never brought any trouts home. Always said you caught plenty. So one time I got your creel case open the night before you went on one a your little trips — price tag still on it after five years — and I tied a note on the end of the line. It said, hello Ennis, bring some fish home, love, Alma. And then you come back and said you’d caught a bunch a browns and ate them up. Remember? I looked in the case when I got a chance and there was my note still tied there and that line hadn’t touched water in its life.”

They weren't going there for fishing, they had so little time together on so rare occasions they didn't spend it fishing, IMO.

[tpe]

But I still wonder about the carelessness.  Considering that Ennis was almost paranoid when it came to being found out, I had wondered why he was so very careless in this small detail...

[vedrana]

But I still wonder about the carelessness.  Considering that Ennis was almost paranoid when it came to being found out, I had wondered why he was so very careless in this small detail...

Tpe , nice to have you back!

Maybe he wasn't thinking about anything when he was with Jack! 

Anyway I see that no one is crazy about  as I am, and no one thinks of fishing as a great thing to do together... It seems it's only me!

[myprivatejack]

But I still wonder about the carelessness.  Considering that Ennis was almost paranoid when it came to being found out, I had wondered why he was so very careless in this small detail...

I agree in that point.Go fishing was a cover,as it could have been whatever "leisure hobby"; but,at least,Ennis could have played the game until the end,being more careful with the"result" of these fishing seasons.I'm not really sure if simply saying that they ate the fishes on the mountain was enough ; one or two times,it could be acceptable,but not so many others more...
Or,the same than the Ennis of the s.s.had realised Alma knew it,it's because someting inside he Ennis of the movie didn't mind if she knew it or not? Even in a subconscious level?...

[aintfoolin]

But I still wonder about the carelessness.  Considering that Ennis was almost paranoid when it came to being found out, I had wondered why he was so very careless in this small detail...

 I think he simply underestimated Alma's cleverness, tying the note to the fishing line. Even if he knew she knew, it was Alma, mother of his girls and she was'nt talking. ....until Thanksgiving anyway and even then there was only a strong implication that she was sure. She never really came out and told Ennis that she saw the kiss., then again, she really did'nt have to, did she? Ennis got the picture.

[tpe]

Tpe , nice to have you back!

Maybe he wasn't thinking about anything when he was with Jack! 

Anyway I see that no one is crazy about  as I am, and no one thinks of fishing as a great thing to do together... It seems it's only me!

Thanks Loreen!  And I like your answer.  Jack was probably too much of a distraction for him to think about all these small details.  This is consisntent with what we see in the Reunion, where the usually cautious Ennis suddenly becaomes reckless...

I agree in that point.Go fishing was a cover,as it could have been whatever "leisure hobby"; but,at least,Ennis could have played the game until the end,being more careful with the"result" of these fishing seasons.I'm not really sure if simply saying that they ate the fishes on the mountain was enough ; one or two times,it could be acceptable,but not so many others more...
Or,the same than the Ennis of the s.s.had realised Alma knew it,it's because someting inside he Ennis of the movie didn't mind if she knew it or not? Even in a subconscious level?...

Perhaps initilally,  Ennis was more careful.  But like so many of us, time begins to make us more careless, with a false sense of security that originates from a sense of the "routine"...

I think he simply underestimated Alma's cleverness, tying the note to the fishing line. Even if he knew she knew, it was Alma, mother of his girls and she was'nt talking. ....until Thanksgiving anyway and even then there was only a strong implication that she was sure. She never really came out and told Ennis that she saw the kiss., then again, she really did'nt have to, did she? Ennis got the picture.

Or perhaps he assumed that even if Alma saw some inconsitencies she wouldn't have the courage or the will to bring them up to him.  I personally thought that Ennis assumed that he and Alma would always obey certain unwritten rules, and that one of them meant that they would not bring certain feelings and suspicions out in the open.  The Thanksgiving scene was the instance where Alma crossed the line, shall we say, in Ennis's eyes...

[myprivatejack]

Or perhaps he assumed that even if Alma saw some inconsitencies she wouldn't have the courage or the will to bring them up to him.  I personally thought that Ennis assumed that he and Alma would always obey certain unwritten rules, and that one of them meant that they would not bring certain feelings and suspicions out in the open.  The Thanksgiving scene was the instance where Alma crossed the line, shall we say, in Ennis's eyes...

Exactly ¡.It's a little bit linked with what I said in my former post about that a point in their marriage had arrived when maybe he didn't mind if she knew it or not,she had some suspicions or not...Maybe he was thinking that,the same than he needed her as a socially respectability cover,she needed him for the same reason-only that the causes are "slightly" different between the two of them...-and,moreover,for her fears to make face to life all alone with two little girls.So,they didn't disturb each other by being at the same time the right and needed security that,as you Thomas say,obeyed to certain unwritten rules.Unwritten,it's true,but felt and,maybe,feared...

[tpe]

Exactly ¡.It's a little bit linked with what I said in my former post about that a point in their marriage had arrived when maybe he didn't mind if she knew it or not,she had some suspicions or not...Maybe he was thinking that,the same than he needed her as a socially respectability cover,she needed him for the same reason-only that the causes are "slightly" different between the two of them...-and,moreover,for her fears to make face to life all alone with two little girls.So,they didn't disturb each other by being at the same time the right and needed security that,as you Thomas say,obeyed to certain unwritten rules.Unwritten,it's true,but felt and,maybe,feared...

Exactly.  I don't think he really cared in the end, so long as she kept it to herself -- stayed within the bounds of those unwritten rules.  I think Ennis underestimated how much all this affected Alma. 

And I do think that the new-found security with Monroe contributed to Alma's newly found courage to disregard these rules.  As painful as it was, I think confronting Ennis at last was also liberating to her.

[vedrana]

Exactly.  I don't think he really cared in the end, so long as she kept it to herself -- stayed within the bounds of those unwritten rules.  I think Ennis underestimated how much all this affected Alma. 

And I do think that the new-found security with Monroe contributed to Alma's newly found courage to disregard these rules.  As painful as it was, I think confronting Ennis at last was also liberating to her.

Well, obviously it was liberating for her! You're right there. For there is no other explanation why she brought that up in so inadequate situation.

The pain she held inside for years suddenly exploded at the moment when no positive outcome was expected. She wanted to hurt him as much as she felt hurt.

[aintfoolin]

I find it ironic that Jack actually got to meet and talk to Ennis's wife, and his girls. How likely is That? Equate it to the *other* woman , or in this case the *other man* meeting his lover's family.

Another Lame question....Did Jack *come on* to Randall?

[tpe]

Well, obviously it was liberating for her! You're right there. For there is no other explanation why she brought that up in so inadequate situation.

The pain she held inside for years suddenly exploded at the moment when no positive outcome was expected. She wanted to hurt him as much as she felt hurt.

She certainly needed the release.  And I think it is no coincidence that after this scene, we don't see Alma ever again.  To have followed this up with some other scene would have been moot.