Author Topic: What did Heath and Jake bring to their characters? (Read 36245 times)

*Froggy* · « **on:** Jan 02, 2006, 04:28 AM »

Hi all,

Annie Proulx's short story did not go into detailed descriptions of either Jack or Ennis. If you have read the short story and seen the movie, what in your opinion, have Jake and Heath brought to their characters.

Were you happy/disappointed about some scenes from the book, from the way Ang Lee made the lead actors act certain scenes? etc.

For example, from the trailers and presentations and various clips i have seen, i have observed that Ennis is a lot more introvert than i had imagined...then again, i still need to see BBM.
But fellow BBM fans...what do you think?

Toadily · « **Reply #1 on:** Jan 02, 2006, 04:43 PM »

I think Jake added more of Jack's longing, and Heath added more of Enni's angst.
The looks and subtle things are so amazing, and can't be in a book.

ennisandjack · « **Reply #2 on:** Jan 03, 2006, 01:41 PM »

I'm still waiting to see the film so I can't fully reply but having seen clips and read the short story I really can't imagine better actors in these roles. They both seem to really have become these characters. Perfect casting if you ask me. I think they both bring depth. I'll write more friday after I finally see the film! My the waiting has been long....

ChefStevo · « **Reply #3 on:** Jan 05, 2006, 12:50 AM »

Well first of all I want to say What a great movie!! I did not read the short story...and I am glad!!!!! Second of all I did not know either actors!!!!! And thats me....I dont watch Movies, or Tv to much....but I heard about this movie...and I had to see it!!!! Then Entertainment Magazine had a private screening...to see how people would react...and guess what....we all LOVED IT!!!!!! And I think they wanted that reaction....but I also thoght they wanted something else....well everyone after it was over just started to clap...and I mean CLAPP! It was a great experience...and I have see it 4 times since....I can't stop watching these actors!!! they are soooooooo GREAT!!!!!
Steven

111

Apollonos · « **Reply #4 on:** Jan 05, 2006, 03:43 AM »

I read that Heath was concerned that he lacked the maturity to pull off the role of Ennis. Well, IMHO, he needn't have worried. He did an incredible job portraying Ennis' stoic nature, while showing the pain that he tried to conceal behind the facade. Both actors brought a youthful innocence and exuberance to their characters, but they also displayed a depth of emotion so powerful that I can't get the movie out of my head. Brokeback Mountain got me good.

stationbbm · « **Reply #5 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 01:15 AM »

Mr. Ledger - What can be the appropriate words to describe the awesome talent displayed in his Ennis? I can only imagine that over the career of an actor, there are certain roles that you "connect with" more than others. Somehow you just "get" the character, and you and the role become one. I think back to Sissy Spacek's Coal Miner's Daughter where she transformed herself into Loretta Lynn and gave the performance of a lifetime. The actor knows it when he/she gets there and so there must be something creatively magical about it. The professional risk for Ledger was enormous and yet he never looked back nor worried himself with how the audience would perceive him. To take bold challenges and then do what he did with such remarkable capacity will certainly put him in a league among the finest actors ever. This may have been his finest hour--so much of what he did seemed so natural....the voice, the stance, the mannerisms, the way he held his hat, the way he handled a horse, the way he responded to people, the look, the unspoken subtleties, on and on...You talk about raising the bar...I still say that no single performance by an actor will ever be matched for a long, long time.

Mr. Gyllenhaal - Although it's too easy to try and compare him to Ledger, Jake stands on his own merits as also having delivered perhaps his finest hour. His ability to counterbalance the stoic, shy and introverted Ennis was moving and compelling. His patience in drawing Ennis out of his shell and reaching out to him was truly amazing. Could there have been others chosen for Jack Twist who might have developed him differently? Oh sure. But the way Jake with his boyish charm so perfectly complemented Ledger was the reason why this film creates the impact it does. Jake loves Ennis. Jake carries the audience's voice in moving the story along. Jake speaks our frustration. Jake pushes Jack out of the screen and into our hearts. How many actors have ever done that so successfully except for the very, very best? He too stands among the brightest, high caliber acting talent who will continue to push for roles that require more and more of the actor.

stationbbm

ChefStevo · « **Reply #6 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 01:25 AM »

Hey StationBBM......you are soooooo good at what you said....I totaly agree!!! I have seen the movie 4 times...and will see it again this week-end.....These 2 actors, even if they didn't know it really, and I mean really did a good job!!!!!! I have seen and ready many interviews with both male actors....and they just hit it good....For me I didn't know either of them....so it was a great experience for me....cause They were great!!!!
Steven

*Froggy* · « **Reply #7 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 04:57 PM »

Well i have finally seen it..so here i go:

Ennis/Heath:..sooooooo Oscar worthy! He did such a great job of it, and like Annie Proulx said in an interview, he went deeper than Ennis could have gone. Ennis s not a man of many words, and Heath portrayed it so beautifully..the looks, the body language, the unexpected little smiles..that mean a thousand things...god was he great!

Jack/Jake:..poor soul...when i cried, i cried for him, with him, or because of him! He does help the story move forward...but i still find that Jack was weaker in the movie than in the short story. Which in a way makes sense, since he was holding onto an impossible love. If Ennis had only said those 3 little words, I believe that Jack would have waited till the end of the world!

chameau · « **Reply #8 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 09:24 PM »

Well they brought flesh and blood to the characters? Heath, without any words can bring you to tears, how was he able to move us, being the silent taciturn Ennis?. What a body language! Jake! All the love in the world was in your eyes looking at your buddy (remember the "bear" scene after Ennis felt down his horse, coming back to the camp with this scratch on his cheek?). Wow! This is not acting, these are real living persons. How such young actors may have done this? Thanks to Annie Proulx's who inspired them, they all read her short story. Thanks for the scenarists that made a wonderfull piece of art from Annie's story. Thanks Ang Lee, the sensible, brilliant director who filmed this like just a documentary, no less, real life! And thank you Heith and Jake (and all the others) for your confidence in Ang's intelligence!

JerBear418720 · « **Reply #9 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 11:02 PM »

I am a HUGE movie nut - I see almost everything and have since I was a kid (I'm 57 now) - and I gotta tell ya, who knew that Heath Ledger was capable of delivering something so amazingly wonderful? All of the actors were great, but Ledger gave us a real gift - a subtle, textured, multi-layered, beautiful performance that will live on in movie legend for years - and all with a bare minimum of dialogue. I'd say put ur money on him for a Best Actor Oscar - and that in a year full of great male performances. I read one review that puts him right up there with Marlon Brando (early stuff like Streetcar Named Desire and On the Waterfront) and Sean Penn - that's pretty impressive company, and DAMN, he earned it!

brokebackmountain · « **Reply #10 on:** Jan 07, 2006, 11:43 PM »

Quote from: JerBear418720 on Jan 07, 2006, 11:02 PM

I am a HUGE movie nut - I see almost everything and have since I was a kid (I'm 57 now) - and I gotta tell ya, who knew that Heath Ledger was capable of delivering something so amazingly wonderful? All of the actors were great, but Ledger gave us a real gift - a subtle, textured, multi-layered, beautiful performance that will live on in movie legend for years - and all with a bare minimum of dialogue. I'd say put ur money on him for a Best Actor Oscar - and that in a year full of great male performances. I read one review that puts him right up there with Marlon Brando (early stuff like Streetcar Named Desire and On the Waterfront) and Sean Penn - that's pretty impressive company, and DAMN, he earned it!

Hello JerBear, welcome and thanks for posting. You said it well. I am putting my money on Heath too (although BBM is the only movie I see among other Oscar contenders).

His performance is excellent.

jimnick · « **Reply #11 on:** Jan 09, 2006, 08:04 PM »

Quote from: JerBear418720 on Jan 07, 2006, 11:02 PM

I am a HUGE movie nut - I see almost everything and have since I was a kid (I'm 57 now) - and I gotta tell ya, who knew that Heath Ledger was capable of delivering something so amazingly wonderful? All of the actors were great, but Ledger gave us a real gift - a subtle, textured, multi-layered, beautiful performance that will live on in movie legend for years - and all with a bare minimum of dialogue. I'd say put ur money on him for a Best Actor Oscar - and that in a year full of great male performances. I read one review that puts him right up there with Marlon Brando (early stuff like Streetcar Named Desire and On the Waterfront) and Sean Penn - that's pretty impressive company, and DAMN, he earned it!

He's REAL> Too real. Is he not? Got to get the Oscar, handsdown!

Jim

chameau · « **Reply #12 on:** Jan 09, 2006, 09:50 PM »

I have some questions, I know best actor/actress, could have two Oscar winners the same year. One example Barbra Streisand (Funny Girl) and Katharine Hepburn (The Lion in Winter) in 1968, two different movies. Technically, does the Academy allows two actors/actresses being nominated for the same movie and the same award? If yes, Jake and Heath should be nominated both for best actor in a leading role.. and winning both! On my second viewing I looked more carefully at Jake's acting, he really moved me, in the last BBM of Ennis and Jack encounter scene, God was he good?. I just find Heath miraculous, if only one Oscar, it's for him. But Jake is very close. Oh my God! The two winning best actors together! I just wanted the share that dream. Another question, Michelle being nominated and winning. Heath being nominated and winning. Would it be the first couple winning, same year, same movie?

Aela · « **Reply #13 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 08:24 AM »

Quote from: chameau on Jan 09, 2006, 09:50 PM

I have some questions, I know best actor/actress, could have two Oscar winners the same year.

They can? News to me.

Quote

Technically, does the Academy allows two actors/actresses being nominated for the same movie and the same award?

It is allowed, but the people behind the movie usually frown upon it. For instance, Focus Features will probably push Heath for Best Actor, and Jake for Best Supporting. They don't like to have two actors from the same movie competing against each other in the same category because they fear that the votes will be 'split' between both, therefore neither person will have enough votes to win.

But there isn't any 'rule' against it. It's just not done in standard practice.

chameau · « **Reply #14 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 02:53 PM »

Quote

Quote from: chameau on Jan 09, 2006, 09:50 PM
I have some questions, I know best actor/actress, could have two Oscar winners the same year.

They can? News to me.

Best actresses in a leading role in 1968, Barbra Streisand (Funny Girl) and Katharine Hepburn (The Lion in Winter)

Quote

It is allowed, but the people behind the movie usually frown upon it. For instance, Focus Features will probably push Heath for Best Actor, and Jake for Best Supporting. They don't like to have two actors from the same movie competing against each other in the same category because they fear that the votes will be 'split' between both, therefore neither person will have enough votes to win.

That's a very good point!

Thanks!

Toadily · « **Reply #15 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 03:00 PM »

Quote from: chameau on Jan 11, 2006, 02:53 PM

Quote
Quote from: chameau on Jan 09, 2006, 09:50 PM
I have some questions, I know best actor/actress, could have two Oscar winners the same year.

They can? News to me.

Best actresses in a leading role in 1968, Barbra Streisand (Funny Girl) and Katharine Hepburn (The Lion in Winter)

Quote
It is allowed, but the people behind the movie usually frown upon it. For instance, Focus Features will probably push Heath for Best Actor, and Jake for Best Supporting. They don't like to have two actors from the same movie competing against each other in the same category because they fear that the votes will be 'split' between both, therefore neither person will have enough votes to win.

That's a very good point!

Thanks!

Yes I am sure they will put Jake up for supporting. Remmber that was done with William H Macy in Fargo, he actually had as much screen time as Marge but that's what they did. It would be cool to have both Heath and Jake win, and See Jake may be more of a shoe in cause Philip Seymor is so strong in Capote.

chameau · « **Reply #16 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 03:35 PM »

I must go see Capote a.s.a.p. (I'm short of time for the Golden Globes, I will try hard) I know I would have a broken hearth Heath not winning. People I know who saw both BBM and Capote could hardly pick up the best in between Heath and Philip. The only thing they could say for sure, Brokeback is the best film. Both are playing homosexuals characters... there is not much to complaint after all, no matter the winner is.

Toadily · « **Reply #17 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 03:38 PM »

Quote from: chameau on Jan 11, 2006, 03:35 PM

I must go see Capote a.s.a.p. (I'm short of time for the Golden Globes, I will try hard) I know I would have a broken hearth Heath not winning. People I know who saw both BBM and Capote could hardly pick up the best in between Heath and Philip. The only thing they could say for sure, Brokeback is the best film. Both are playing homosexuals characters... there is not much to complaint after all, no matter the winner is.

Right how do you decide the "best" among such two great jobs? Our boy just has to know that is if it doesn't go his way.
Sometimes I am with Woody Allen, remember in Annie Hall when he says "Awards, awards, they keep giving out awards...best fascist dictator Adolph Hitler..." Part of me is turned off to them, there are way too many etc I mean the academy awards started out just a banquet amongs ttheir own, now they know the public views it like royalty so they puffed it up etc.

chameau · « **Reply #18 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 03:52 PM »

I will go see Capote for sure and let you know... Being romantic, I believe I will stick to Heath's moving performance. But we never know.

Toadily · « **Reply #19 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 03:59 PM »

I go with Heath cause he had a more demanding role, aging for one, which I thought he did famously.
The slouching and little touches that made him a middle aged burnt out guy. And the love scenes, let's face it
not a lot of prior work to look to for that!

so I can cleanly say he should win hands down. But I am biased of course!

chameau · « **Reply #20 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 04:25 PM »

I will also mention, his better than real Texan accent. Also, the watery eyes at the divorce scene and at the very end... Jack, I swear, with watery eyes too.. O.k. got watery eyes writing this. And I'm at work! PBS!

*Froggy* · « **Reply #21 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 04:35 PM »

Quote from: chameau on Jan 11, 2006, 04:25 PM

I will also mention, his better than real Texan accent. Also, the watery eyes at the divorce scene and at the very end... Jack, I swear, with watery eyes too.. O.k. got watery eyes writing this. And I'm at work! PBS!

*Froggy passes the tissues over to Chameau*

chameau · « **Reply #22 on:** Jan 11, 2006, 04:40 PM »

Thanks but need more towels...

jimnick · « **Reply #23 on:** Jan 14, 2006, 03:14 PM »

Quote from: chameau on Jan 11, 2006, 03:35 PM

I must go see Capote a.s.a.p. (I'm short of time for the Golden Globes, I will try hard) I know I would have a broken hearth Heath not winning. People I know who saw both BBM and Capote could hardly pick up the best in between Heath and Philip. The only thing they could say for sure, Brokeback is the best film. Both are playing homosexuals characters... there is not much to complaint after all, no matter the winner is.

Saw Capote last night, Brokeback Mountain was playing in the adjacent theater so I ducked in a couple times under the guise of getting popcorn and going to the restroom. My partner's getting sick of my PBS. anyway Capote is a really good film too, it's not Brokeback mountain but it is very good and if you know about Capote you'll think it's fairly accurate. My favorite line is when Truman Capote says to Perry Smith: "Write to me every five minutes." Reminds me of me.

daveya26 · « **Reply #24 on:** Jan 15, 2006, 12:05 PM »

Quote from: frog123 on Jan 02, 2006, 04:28 AM

Hi all,

Annie Proulx's short story did not go into detailed descriptions of either Jack or Ennis. If you have read the short story and seen the movie, what in your opinion, have Jake and Heath brought to their characters.

Were you happy/disappointed about some scenes from the book, from the way Ang Lee made the lead actors act certain scenes? etc.

For example, from the trailers and presentations and various clips i have seen, i have observed that Ennis is a lot more introvert than i had imagined...then again, i still need to see BBM.
But fellow BBM fans...what do you think?

Hi Frog

I read ths story about a week after seeing the movie and I have to say, I dont think Ive ever known of a bettrer book to screen tranisition. The screenwriters took one line elements describing a situation and turned it into a whole scene that further supported what the movie was trying to convey. E.g. we get one line saying that Jack meets Lureen at the rodeo, the film shows us in more detail how. How odd would it've been to suddenly just see Jack married with this girl we hadnt seen before?

Actually the whole rodeo stuff is only briefly mentioned in the book too but the cowboy scene reinforces the danger Jack puts himself in, so we appreciate more how likely it was that he was murdered at the end.

I think Ennis is defined as being a silent type but it's not very explicitly stated and the movie brings out that aspect of him more - its important for the movie though, Ennis has to be that way to offset how Jack is. One person said on IMDB that they couldnt understand what Ennis was saying sometimes, I think that was the beaity of the performance, you werent meant to be able understand him too well.

aconite20 · « **Reply #25 on:** Jan 15, 2006, 05:27 PM »

i didn't know much about the two actors before this movie, i knew one had done something medieval and one did something with the girl from "friends" However now i've watched tv interviews, press conferences, and chat shows that the two lads have done and i have a question. Are the lads somewhat like their characters.

Is Heath in real life like his character, Ennis. He talks hesitantly, he rarely smiles and when he does is very hesitant and the smile does not enhance his face, He never looks anyone in the eye, his speech is mumbled. His whole body language is Ennis.

And Jake, he smiles and the smile lights up his face, he chats easily. Interacts with his host or interviewer, he has a lovely openness about him and a certain vulnerability as well.

At a press conference Jake made a joke about the reunion kiss wheras Heath brushed it away gruffly and said it was work. Heath was as gruff as Ennis would be, Jake was as open as Jack. Even as they sat at the table being questioned by the press Heath sat there not moving and Jake moved around looking from side to side smiling at everyone.

Have they always been like this and if so, was this the reason they got the task of the portrayals on the big screen. They could bring aspects of themselves to the characters. They fit it so well.

I know its impossible for us to "know" the lads. Only someone who truly knows them can answer this question. But,I would like to hear what others think.

brokebackmountain · « **Reply #26 on:** Jan 15, 2006, 09:05 PM »

Quote from: aconite20 on Jan 15, 2006, 05:27 PM

i didn't know much about the two actors before this movie, i knew one had done something medieval and one did something with the girl from "friends" However now i've watched tv interviews, press conferences, and chat shows that the two lads have done and i have a question. Are the lads somewhat like their characters.

Is Heath in real life like his character, Ennis. He talks hesitantly, he rarely smiles and when he does is very hesitant and the smile does not enhance his face, He never looks anyone in the eye, his speech is mumbled. His whole body language is Ennis.

And Jake, he smiles and the smile lights up his face, he chats easily. Interacts with his host or interviewer, he has a lovely openness about him and a certain vulnerability as well.

At a press conference Jake made a joke about the reunion kiss wheras Heath brushed it away gruffly and said it was work. Heath was as gruff as Ennis would be, Jake was as open as Jack. Even as they sat at the table being questioned by the press Heath sat there not moving and Jake moved around looking from side to side smiling at everyone.

Have they always been like this and if so, was this the reason they got the task of the portrayals on the big screen. They could bring aspects of themselves to the characters. They fit it so well.

I know its impossible for us to "know" the lads. Only someone who truly knows them can answer this question. But,I would like to hear what others think.

Like you, I didn't know about Heath and Jake until BBM. The question of resembling Ennis came right to my mind after I watched Heath on an interview video. I am not sure about Jake but from LOGO Video (a must see), the screenwriters already had Heath in mind to portray Ennis a few years back. Not to discount the brilliant performance Heath delivered in any way but he and Ennis are similar in some ways.

aconite20 · « **Reply #27 on:** Jan 16, 2006, 03:01 AM »

I'm not in any way trying to put down Heath's portrayal of Ennis or Jake's of Jack, they were two very very powerful performances. I hope it didn't come over as that. They are two actors I will watch from now on.

By the way did I read somewhere that Matt Damon was first choice to play Ennis, He turned it down because he had played a few gay roles and didn't want to play one again so soon. Glad he didn't, Heath is Ennis, without a doubt. (Well, he's not really, but you know what I mean!!!)

dougl · « **Reply #28 on:** Jan 16, 2006, 08:24 AM »

I just can't imagine anyone doing these roles except Heath and Jake. This was a perfectly cast movie. The group certainly deserves the Golden Globe award tonight for best performance as a group. Would love to see Heath win best actor but he is up against some tough competition. He will always be a winner in my short story. I have relived my life through Jack over and over because of this movie. Most of which I was "finally" able to put behind me. Now the ghost are here haunting me day and night. Glad Matt Damon did not play the role. He is way to soft to portray an rough cow/sheep hand.
Doug

daveya26 · « **Reply #29 on:** Jan 16, 2006, 09:00 AM »

Hi

I like Matt Damon a lot and I think he couldve done a decent job of this role. However, I too couldnt imagine anyone but Heath in the role now, but that's in hindsight, who knew he was capable of such great acting?!

Also, Matt is far too small, Ennis needed to be a big chap I think - apart from that, Matt's ambigious sexuality (but primarily gay role) in Talented Mr Ripley wouldve definitely overshadowed any performance he gave as Ennis.

Actually, I feel Talented Mr Ripley and BBM are fairly similar for me - theyre both slow burning movies that look deeply into the psychology of the protagonists, dealing with regret and mistakes made that change you forever, theyre both also beautiful movies to look at - however, the love Tom Ripley has for Dickie is obviously very twisted and nothing like that of Jack and Ennis. Anyway, I know what I mean lol