Author Topic: Spittle (Read 102060 times)

cornflake · « **on:** Nov 30, 2006, 03:17 AM »

Hello together,

don´t know if this thread already exist...
yesterday i discorvered that in the snit scene there is a little but of spittle between ennis´ and jack´s mouths

very funny and sexy to see *g*

tpe · « **Reply #1 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 08:31 AM »

Hello cornflake. Yes, that had been noted in an old thread, although it has not been a subject of a thread -- if I recall correctly. Perhaps we should consider this thread as a discussion of the use of spitting/spittle to highten dramatic tension in the various scenes.

Specifically, I note that in the post-divorce meeting (am I correct?) as well as in the final meeting, Ennis spits at certain critical points. I got the impression that this was a mannerism that he uses in part to decrease tension.

As for the scene you mention, it shows us how real the action was. They were really kissing -- not just pretending to kiss.

cornflake · « **Reply #2 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 08:51 AM »

tpe, you´re right! that´s the most importan thing.. they were REALLY kissing.. omg that´s wonderful *sniff*

tpe · « **Reply #3 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 09:03 AM »

I noticed the thread of saliva on my second viewing. I found it deeply poetic: a thin bridge connecting two struggling souls.

FlwrChild · « **Reply #4 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 01:37 PM »

tpe, even after a few viewings, I didn't notice it till someone pointed it out to me. The next time I watched, it bothered me a little (don't know why). But since then I've looked at it more the way you do. It's part of their connection. And I do like that it's so real too. I can't say enough about how impressed I was with these actors.

cornflake · « **Reply #5 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 05:32 PM »

tpe, that´s so sweet. omg, i love this scene.
do u think it was an accident by the actors... or was it the plan?

tpe · « **Reply #6 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 05:42 PM »

Quote from: FlwrChild on Nov 30, 2006, 01:37 PM

tpe, even after a few viewings, I didn't notice it till someone pointed it out to me. The next time I watched, it bothered me a little (don't know why). But since then I've looked at it more the way you do. It's part of their connection. And I do like that it's so real too. I can't say enough about how impressed I was with these actors.

I was quite impressed when I first noticed it. There was no attempt to make it look "neat". It spoke of honesty. And there was nothing disgusting about this detail.

tpe · « **Reply #7 on:** Nov 30, 2006, 05:48 PM »

Quote from: cornflake on Nov 30, 2006, 05:32 PM

tpe, that´s so sweet. omg, i love this scene.
do u think it was an accident by the actors... or was it the plan?

I think the actors certainly intended to do a true-to-life kiss. It just so happened that this detail was inadvertently captured during filming. Did they do many takes on this? I seem to recall Jake saying that they did this a number of times (or was it the other kiss?) If there were many takes, then it is plausible that Ang Lee noticed this detail and chose it -- to show the realism of that kiss.

greenfrog · « **Reply #8 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 12:46 AM »

Quote from: cornflake on Nov 30, 2006, 05:32 PM

tpe, that´s so sweet. omg, i love this scene.
do u think it was an accident by the actors... or was it the plan?

I wonder how they would have pulled it off if it was intentional?

cornflake · « **Reply #9 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 02:43 AM »

don´t know, too

tpe · « **Reply #10 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 09:42 AM »

Quote from: greenfrog on Dec 01, 2006, 12:46 AM

I wonder how they would have pulled it off if it was intentional?

They did say that it was just like kissing another fellow human being... I can see that after a few tries, the novelty of it all wears off rather quickly for both of them.

jesseanne21 · « **Reply #11 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 02:28 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Dec 01, 2006, 09:42 AM

Quote from: greenfrog on Dec 01, 2006, 12:46 AM
I wonder how they would have pulled it off if it was intentional?

They did say that it was just like kissing another fellow human being... I can see that after a few tries, the novelty of it all wears off rather quickly for both of them.

Still, to me, it was one of the all time best SCREEN kisses I have ever seen...it made my toes curl!

tpe · « **Reply #12 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 04:28 PM »

I would cite the two great ones in this film: the SNIT kiss, and the Reunion kiss. I can't choose between the two, although (back to the saliva), the former is more tender and intimate, whereas the latter just lifts you off your feet.

ksxks · « **Reply #13 on:** Dec 01, 2006, 07:48 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Dec 01, 2006, 04:28 PM

I would cite the two great ones in this film: the SNIT kiss, and the Reunion kiss. I can't choose between the two, although (back to the saliva), the former is more tender and intimate, whereas the latter just lifts you off your feet.

I loved the saliva in the SNIT kiss, noticed it probably the second time also, as you did, tpe. Oh, right there on the gigantic screen -- I thought it was quite hot.

As to the whole spitting thing, I've discussed this before in a fanfic thread but haven't come to any very good conclusions. And it was discussed here, too, whenever that was. I guess I'm one who thinks just that it was a common thing to do, for men in this time and place to spit -- also because it's all dusty and stuff, where they live and work. I think it was used to good effect in all the scenes, as kind of punctuation, but I wouldn't go too much deeper than that...though if anyone else does I'd be interested. I love all the minutest symbology in these discussions of the film.

As to Ennis spitting on his hand to use on himself in the FNIT sex...all I can say is...well I think I won't say it. TMI perhaps. Just that it was a fascinating detail in this fascinating scene. (Purely cimematic/literary appreciation, you know.) (Excuse me while I cool down.)

kathy

LuvJackNasty · « **Reply #14 on:** Dec 02, 2006, 12:00 AM »

OH I love the spit string!

I think it was the reunion kiss that they did a lot of takes on- I think at Michelle's request if I am not mistaken (read that somewhere here). I love both kisses- I now cry through both scenes. Both are tender in their own way- the SNIT because it's the first and it's just so tender and intimate. The reunion because they are breathing for the first time in 4 years and the way Jack looks almost as if he's going to cry because he may have hoped for that but I don't think he was expecting it to happen like that.

carbyville · « **Reply #15 on:** Dec 02, 2006, 01:23 AM »

I, too love the spittle. Noticed it right away the first time I saw the movie.

aintfoolin · « **Reply #16 on:** Dec 02, 2006, 08:33 PM »

I did'nt notice it at first but when I did I thought DAMN this is REAL! So erotic.

carbyville · « **Reply #17 on:** Dec 02, 2006, 08:43 PM »

NoReins · « **Reply #18 on:** Dec 03, 2006, 07:05 AM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 02, 2006, 08:43 PM

Beautiful

Don't really know why, but that spit string makes me feel all gooey inside...

carbyville · « **Reply #19 on:** Dec 03, 2006, 04:11 PM »

Quote from: NoReins on Dec 03, 2006, 07:05 AM

Beautiful Don't really know why, but that spit string makes me feel all gooey inside...

I know. It really is sort of a quirky thing to get all mushy about.

ksxks · « **Reply #20 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 01:50 AM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 02, 2006, 08:43 PM

Oh thank you carbyville -- thank you. Beautiful and hot.

kathy

ksxks · « **Reply #21 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 01:52 AM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 03, 2006, 04:11 PM

I know. It really is sort of a quirky thing to get all mushy about.

Not really. Bodily fluids = sex, sex, sexy. Also, as a very real appreciation for these two men to have done this to make Ennis and Jack real.

kathy

greenfrog · « **Reply #22 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 01:53 AM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 02, 2006, 08:43 PM

This is such a beautiful picture Carby

carbyville · « **Reply #23 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 03:10 AM »

Quote from: ksxks on Dec 04, 2006, 01:52 AM

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 03, 2006, 04:11 PM
I know. It really is sort of a quirky thing to get all mushy about.

Not really. Bodily fluids = sex, sex, sexy. Also, as a very real appreciation for these two men to have done this to make Ennis and Jack real.

kathy

Of course. But I mean it's quirky when compared to everything else in that scene. Shirtless Jack, Ennis exploring Jack's chest with his hands, Jack on top of Ennis, the hunger in their kisses, the tenderness of it all. Out of all that, we are talking about a little bit of spittle that some people probably don't even notice right away. Just makes it quirky to me.

aintfoolin · « **Reply #24 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 05:37 AM »

It adds to this this tender ,yet very erotic scene.

tpe · « **Reply #25 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 09:15 AM »

The detail about Ennis applying spittle on himself is of course in the short story. Although I half-expected it, I must admit that I did like the way this was realized cinematically -- very matter-of-factly, I should add.

The thread of spittle is a wonderful detail that certainly makes you believe in their new-found intimacy. It made the enite SNIT all the more beautiful.

CrimsonSky · « **Reply #26 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 05:57 PM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 04, 2006, 03:10 AM

Of course. But I mean it's quirky when compared to everything else in that scene. Shirtless Jack, Ennis exploring Jack's chest with his hands, Jack on top of Ennis, the hunger in their kisses, the tenderness of it all. Out of all that, we are talking about a little bit of spittle that some people probably don't even notice right away. Just makes it quirky to me.

Great list there, carbyville

That scene is just the most beautiful, most mesmerising love scene, like, ever IMO

The spit string is just the icing on the cake for me, it makes me go all gooey inside

I thought I noticed it the first time, but I wasn't 100% sure if it was just my imagination, I nearly passed out when I watched it again and saw it was real...OMG,I so want to watch that scene again NOW, but I've promised myself not to watch the DVD until the London get-together, I haven't cracked yet and it's been nearly four months

Roll on Saturday

CrimsonSky · « **Reply #27 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 06:19 PM »

Quote from: tpe on Dec 04, 2006, 09:15 AM

The detail about Ennis applying spittle on himself is of course in the short story. Although I half-expected it, I must admit that I did like the way this was realized cinematically -- very matter-of-factly, I should add.

The thread of spittle is a wonderful detail that certainly makes you believe in their new-found intimacy. It made the enite SNIT all the more beautiful.

I hadn't read the ss when I first saw the movie, so I had no idea what to expect from FNIT. When I saw Ennis spitting my eyes nearly popped out of my head! I wasn't shocked in a prudish sort of way (it would take a lot more than that to shock me!), but because I didn't expect it to be so gritty and realistic. It certainly wasn't your average Hollywood sex scene, all nice and clean and perfect, and not particularly believable ::)I imagine a lot of people were quite shocked by it, and probably found Ennis spitting on himself distasteful, but I thought it was brilliantly done in the context of the scene, you get a real sense of how raw and instinctive that first night was for both of them, all that wild passion let loose...Wow!! Of course when I read the ss, it made even more sense why it was there. They could have not included it of course, but I'm glad they did, the scene wouldn't have worked as well without it

greenfrog · « **Reply #28 on:** Dec 04, 2006, 08:03 PM »

Quote from: carbyville on Dec 04, 2006, 03:10 AM

Of course. But I mean it's quirky when compared to everything else in that scene. Shirtless Jack, Ennis exploring Jack's chest with his hands, Jack on top of Ennis, the hunger in their kisses, the tenderness of it all. Out of all that, we are talking about a little bit of spittle that some people probably don't even notice right away. Just makes it quirky to me.

Beautiful description Carby

tpe · « **Reply #29 on:** Dec 05, 2006, 10:11 AM »

Quote from: CrimsonSky on Dec 04, 2006, 06:19 PM

I hadn't read the ss when I first saw the movie, so I had no idea what to expect from FNIT. When I saw Ennis spitting my eyes nearly popped out of my head! I wasn't shocked in a prudish sort of way (it would take a lot more than that to shock me!), but because I didn't expect it to be so gritty and realistic. It certainly wasn't your average Hollywood sex scene, all nice and clean and perfect, and not particularly believable ::)I imagine a lot of people were quite shocked by it, and probably found Ennis spitting on himself distasteful, but I thought it was brilliantly done in the context of the scene, you get a real sense of how raw and instinctive that first night was for both of them, all that wild passion let loose...Wow!! Of course when I read the ss, it made even more sense why it was there. They could have not included it of course, but I'm glad they did, the scene wouldn't have worked as well without it

That they included it shows their sensitivity to the details of the short story. Still -- as you had noted -- that detail was effectively realized: nothing explicit, everything implied, but you had no doubt about what was being done. And it looked so natural -- too natural, for some, I believe. The main criticism from some quarters was that Ennis seemed to know exactly what to do. Well, the short story also put this quite nicely. There is a fluidity to the FNIT that hides behind the obvious "animalism" that prevails. Quite beautifully done. Like a short divertissement in a ballet...